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Hi, my first post here!

Hope that someone can help me to identify some Seitz jewels…

I bought some NOS jewels at auction, but now I’m not really sure what kind of jewels they are. All envelopes has the design in the picture. Is there a difference in envelope design for the different types of Seitz jewels?

I’m curious to find out, since some Seitz flat jewels with olive hole and Seitz regular flat jewels have the same size, like 12/70, 12/80 12/90 or 16/100, 16/110, 16/120. And I can’t tell which one it is just by looking at them.  

Also, some envelopes has ’B’ as prefix (like B11/70), I guess those are balance jewels?

Thankful for help!

20240616_224702.jpg

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1) flat jewel for wheels: picture shows a jewel with oil sink. Straight hole. Not hole 8 or 9.

2) balance jewel, olive hole: picture shows a domed jewel without oil sink. B + sizes.

3) flat jewel, olive hole: hole size 8 or 9 only.

Frank

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2 hours ago, Carlsson said:

Thank you Frank! Are flat jewels for wheels the most common type in a standard, say, 17 jewels movement?

As there are more wheels than balances in a movement, I would say yes. 😀

Frank

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20 hours ago, praezis said:

1) flat jewel for wheels: picture shows a jewel with oil sink. Straight hole. Not hole 8 or 9.

2) balance jewel, olive hole: picture shows a domed jewel without oil sink. B + sizes.

3) flat jewel, olive hole: hole size 8 or 9 only.

Frank

B = Bombe ?

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23 minutes ago, praezis said:

As there are more wheels than balances in a movement, I would say yes. 😀

Frank

I was thinking compared to the one with olive holes 🙂 Sorry, this is a completely new area for me 😀

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OK, so here we have both olive and regular jewels, where some have the same specs, like the 10/70, 10/80 etc. If I have a Seitz envelope thats only says "10/70", how do I know it's an olive or regular jewel? Just trying to understand 🙂

Seitz stenar modeller.png

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52 minutes ago, Carlsson said:

OK, so here we have both olive and regular jewels, where some have the same specs, like the 10/70, 10/80 etc. If I have a Seitz envelope thats only says "10/70", how do I know it's an olive or regular jewel? Just trying to understand 🙂

Seitz stenar modeller.png

If it doesn't specify i imagine it will be a standard hole, if its olive then i suspect it will be labelled as such.  Did you say some envelopes have a ' B ' on them. Inspect the 2 types to see the difference 

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Here are the three different types of envelopes I have. I guess the one to the left must be regular flat. The one in the middle (with 'B') are balance jewels. What about the one to the right?

20240618_073624.jpg

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12 hours ago, AndyGSi said:

Have you taken any out and had a look at them?

Yes, but its really hard to tell if it is an regular/straight hole or an olive hole. Guess I need a microscope for that. The domed are easy, but not the other ones.

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23 minutes ago, AndyGSi said:

You should be able to tell with a good loop or magnifier.

Oh, I forgot that I actually have an old digital microscope 🙂 So, this is how a 17/160 jewel looks like. Would you say this one has a regular hole? Thank's for your help!

Bild2.png

Bild3.png

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10 minutes ago, RichardHarris123 said:

I don't know if it's just the photo but the hole looks really rough. 

Bottom photo hole looks battered.

22 minutes ago, Carlsson said:

Oh, I forgot that I actually have an old digital microscope 🙂 So, this is how a 17/160 jewel looks like. Would you say this one has a regular hole? Thank's for your help!

Bild2.png

Bild3.png

I think you'd expect to see no refection where the olive shape is , the light would bounce sideways of it instead of up. 

If you tilt the jewel i think you would see it.

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That jewel hole looks jagged maybe a trick of the light. Some jewels have a small recess which is to help lubricate the pivot. 
On a winder point I have draws of jewels but when needing a jewel, which I must say happens very rarely I never seem to have the jewel needed in my stock. Much the same for balance staffs lots in stock but never the one I need. 

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