Jump to content

New balance staff not riveting to balance

Recommended Posts

6 hours ago, VWatchie said:

There's no need to be condescending Frank. All I am trying to convey is that there is no risk of the stake reaching the hole in the balance when using a Platax tool.

But that is a different pair of shoes, I never talked of that. I assume that the tool will not reach the hole, no matter what you use. Easy with simple stake, too, if you keep the stake between your fingers while hammering.
When I push the staff out after removing the hub, I use a stake with cylindrical pivot, a bit smaller than the hole.  

As I said, no punching method or tool can protect the hole 
- from widening by the distorted staff
- from distorting hole and balance arm to a funnel-like shape if the rivet is too thick (happened to me decades ago).

I apologize if I seemed to be condescending, tried to say it friendly, but meanwhile I am tired of repeating the facts. But I know now, we had different issues in mind.

Regards, Frank 



  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, praezis said:

I apologize if I seemed to be condescending, tried to say it friendly, but meanwhile I am tired of repeating the facts. But I know now, we had different issues in mind.

No worries Frank! I see where you're coming from and thanks for clarifying! 🙂

I would really hope someone, @Jon(!?) would make a video of how to punch out a staff using a staking set without first removing the hub or the rivet. Yes, Frank, you have clearly demonstrated that it is destructive, but for those of us who have no other option and are willing to risk it.

I haven't tried it but one dear WRT member whom we haven't seen in a long time, @HSL (anyone in touch with him?), recommended I try to remove as much as possible of the rivet before punching it out by using a razor-sharpened stake. Yes, I know, it is the hub that you must remove using a lathe, but at least I would think/hope that removing the rivet would be a step in the right direction.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Picking up this side-tracked post again as I just removed a balance staff of a 1920's Omega (35,5L-T1)

I was impressed by the way @Delgetti had his setup when he had to change out a balance-staff (https://www.watchrepairtalk.com/topic/28854-new-balance-staff-not-riveting-to-balance/page/2/#comment-244054

Not only that, but also the idea of removing the seat first before punching the staff out from the seat-side, avoiding the whole discussion of the rivet yes/no enlarging the hole.

I didn't have the fancy clamps & tools Delgetti has, so I used my screw-head polishing tool.



Initially I used #1500 grit diamond paste on the steel wheel, which kinda worked, but very slow. I changed to #800 grit diamond paste, which worked better, but still slow.

Then I glued #240 sanding paper to the steel disk;



That worked and the disk was hand-driven.

Once close to the balance wheel, I took the sanding paper off and continued with #800 diamond paste.

One can only do this when the balance wheel sits true on the staff and has no "wobble".

I went on grinding until I saw some diamond paste on the rim of the balance wheel. This was as far as I could grind and it seemed that at that point there wasn't much left of the seat.


Carefully, with my staking set, I knocked the staff from the seat-side out.

Turns out that the thickness of the seat left, now a small ring, was only 0.1mm.

The balance wheel hole is in perfect shape and no damage done to the wheel at all.


Of course, if the wheel has a "wobble" or isn't seated true on the balance staff, you can't get as close and there will be more left of the seat.

In my case, it worked perfect 🙂

I'm very happy how this method worked out ! 😊


Edited by Endeavor
  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This way is dangerous. The problem is that the collet is not expected to be perfect in this tool and the wheel used for the grinding is big and easy can touch the balance wheel. Can You show the bottom side of the balance wheel?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, nevenbekriev said:

The problem is that the collet is not expected to be perfect in this tool and the wheel used for the grinding is big and easy can touch the balance wheel

The whole process and the progress are closely observed, it's hand-driven and very controlled. I can't see the "danger", unless you are watching the TV while doing it.

As you could have read,

10 hours ago, Endeavor said:

no damage done to the wheel at all.

and in this quote "wheel" is the balance-wheel.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I also see a bit of danger for the wheel, at least you have to keep away from it and may get a too thick rest ring. My rest rings are about 0.05 mm.

Better way would be a grinding wheel touching the staff with its circumference.


  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 hours ago, Endeavor said:

Of course, if the wheel has a "wobble" or isn't seated true on the balance staff, you can't get as close and there will be more left of the seat.

Not having all the fancy equipment, this is a way I came up with. I never said it was the best, the most ideal or the safest way.

Working on balances is always a delicate task whereby full concentration & common sense should prevail.

I was well aware of the "dangers" / short comings involved, hence my "warnings", as quoted above.

The balance wheel of the Omega was nice true, flat and one could clearly see how much gap there was left before the grinding wheel would touch the balance wheel. I stopped when the generously applied diamond paste started to touch the rim of the balance wheel, which turned out to be with a seat thickness left of 0.1mm. Tapping the remainder of the staff out went easy and flawless.

My idea of penning this article was to show/share a way which, in my case, succeeded perfectly. If deemed to risky, or if the balance wheel is not true or has a wobble, other methods have to be followed (which BTW, as you can read in this thread, are rife with "dangers" as well)

Edited by Endeavor
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 4/8/2024 at 10:26 AM, VWatchie said:

Thanks! I never heard the expression before but it makes sense. Looking at the pictures again it says "braclet" (misspelled).

You often see the term used on old watch part boxes.  Staffs for bracelet watches, timing washers for bracelet wstches etc.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Topics

  • Posts

    • ...and if you haven't found this already, here is the oiling chart: https://miyotamovement.com/product/8215/ --> scroll down to "Parts list/Exploded view" and open the tab.   
    • A worn winding pinion wouldn't release the power, as the click is holding the crown wheel. 
    • The problem with a watch like this is where is the technical information? I wasn't even sure that was even based on anything it looks from the link I have below it is based on a real watch well loosely based so maybe there's technical? https://calibercorner.com/pts-caliber-dg-2813/ There guess the watch company has a tiny bit of technical they acknowledge they made the watch but not seeing any service information? https://miyotamovement.com/product/8215/ I did finally find a service sheet for the watch but as it said in the first link it's not an exact clone so that will be some variations. The problem with the Chinese watches they do not supply any technical information spare parts or anything at all other than a cheap watch Which is fine until you go to service the thing and then they'll be problems. On the other hand there clone of the 6497/6498 pocketwatch is almost identical and that means that there is a Swiss tech sheet available which is very very close unlike here where there'll be some differences Now this is a much better choice for watch as they have a website. I'm attaching the technical information for your watch from the website at least they have a really decent service guide versus the Chinese. https://www.timemodule.com/             8691_276584548-Spare-parts-reference-for-the-Miyota-8205-8215-movement.pdf NH35_PL.pdf NH35_SS.pdf NH35_TG.pdf
    • Guys, thanks for your help! According to the advice of a colleague @nevenbekriev, I managed to straighten the spring. Surprisingly, it turned out completely flat. Like new. And the watch after that, for the first time since it was with me, started running late. 🙂 That's great news!!! The rotation of the weights is about 190/200 degrees. In the past 12 hours, it was 4 minutes late. I still have enough room to speed it up. Looks like everything will be OK.  Thank you very much for your help!
    • Thank you for this post. Adding on to it, I've done a little digging trying to get the most bang for my buck. So I really wanted a set that had a base. You can buy the screwdrivers for around $33 usd 10 Piece Screwdriver Set. The base is around $32 usd Rotating Screwdriver Base (Grey) plus $20 in shipping, with tax you are looking at about $90 which is an excellent deal for what you get but I still didn't want to spend that much. I saw that they had the 9 piece set w/ base for $59 usd 9 Piece Screwdriver Set W/Base and I had a 'welcome discount' and got a matching 3mm screwdriver for 99 cents. 3mm Screwdriver. (without the discount the screwdriver is $6) With free shipping my total was $66.55 usd. So, I saved about $24 to go without a slot for a 3mm screwdriver. I'll take that! I hope this helps anyone looking to save a buck or two. Also, this corrects the issue of the orange 1.8mm screwdriver. 😉
  • Create New...