Video for installing a NEW mainspring

[kd8tzc]

I've seen lots of videos on how to remove a mainspring and how to wind one, and then install one.  But does anyone know of a video that shows how to install a brand new mainspring out of the package and into a main spring barrel?  It seems fairly straight forward, but I'm sure there are a few gotcha's.

If anyone has any tips and/or videos that they know of, I would appreciate it.  I have my new mainspring for my 11DP movement and want to get it right the first time.

Thanks!

[mikepilk]

What sort of spring is it? If it's a standard end, it's fairly simple to just push them in. Make sure it's the correct way up, and the spring is sitting within the barrel.

The way I do it :  I push it down on the spring with the flat end of some brass tweezers until the spring is flat with the washer, but still held  in the washer. Then using the pointy end of the tweezers, I start working around the outer coils, making sure I push the spring end in first. 

If it's a T-end, good luck .  There's a way to do it shown in the video (from 35m)

 

 

[kd8tzc]

Thanks... I do have a T end one, but that's not the one I am working on this time. 

[Neverenoughwatches]

45 minutes ago, mikepilk said:

If it's a T-end, good luck

Haha i second that . Even carefully set up it can still  jump around and miss the barrel slot. But basic end mainsprings same as Mike with the back end of some brass tweezers. I am a little more gungho, once i know the spring is located in  the barrel its just a swift push and hooe it doesn't have chance to go anywhere beside into the barrel fully.

[kd8tzc]

That was easy enough...  Now I just have to get the arbor to grab that slot and close it up.

Am I correct that as long as I have the arbor inside the spring (even if not fastened), that it will fasten the first time I wind it?

[mikepilk]

43 minutes ago, kd8tzc said:

That was easy enough...  Now I just have to get the arbor to grab that slot and close it up.

Am I correct that as long as I have the arbor inside the spring (even if not fastened), that it will fasten the first time I wind it?

By "close it up" do you mean that the inner coil is wider than the arbor?  If so, you have to close it until it's a good fit, but DON'T just squeeze the inner coil, it will collapse (don't ask how I know this ). You can close it using some round nose pliers.  Or you could reduce the hardness to lesson the chance of breakage as shown in this video (I'm not a follower of this guy. I just came across this useful video) :

 

[kd8tzc]

No, close it up meaning, I need to put the lid on it and all that. 

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, kd8tzc said:

Am I correct that as long as I have the arbor inside the spring (even if not fastened), that it will fasten the first time I wind it?

Not necessarily , better to make sure the arbor is hooked onto the mainspring and all is good before fitting the lid. Some swearing would ensue if you have to disassemble to solve an issue inside the barrel.

[JohnR725]

3 hours ago, mikepilk said:

If it's a T-end, good luck

somewhere in the group we were having a discussion of how to put the T end Springs in most the people were doing it by hand but I keep saying you can use your winder. So I asked if they would be interested and they indicated they would so somewhere lurking in the computer is about 10 the 15 pictures on exactly how to insert with the mainspring winder I is need to get around to doing it.

I would like to say that it's super super easy but in my example photos the first Hamilton it was a real pain in the ass even with the winder. The other two wed in in less than five minutes basically as fast as you can wind it in and shove it in you are in but not the Hamilton's and if you would hand wound you would have the same problem.

So someday I'll get around to posting pictures.

46 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Not necessarily , better to make sure the arbor is hooked onto the mainspring and all is good before fitting the lid. Some swearing would ensue if you have to disassemble to solve an issue inside the barrel.

usually as long as the arbor? Like the mainspring winders the arbor has to be the right size for the mainspring that you have or specifically you have to have the right mainspring for this watch. So as long as the arbor goes in with a reasonable amount of pain in the ass to get it in it should look. But you could grab a with your pin vice and gently twist just to make sure it actually is hoped if you're dealing with American pocket watches those sometimes you'll find arbor come which we dropped right through if it's out of the watch and in the watch it isn't necessarily any better so yes it probably is good to make sure that its rights because it is a pain to get the watch altogether only to find that it makes a nice slipping sound that's not really very nice. Oh but just remember initially the very first time it might slip until everything catches it just shouldn't make the slipping sound continuously. Not that any of us would have any knowledge of that sort of thing.

[HectorLooi]

 

I watched Alex putting in a "T" ended spring last night. He used a brass rod to move the "T" into the slot by pushing against it until the whole coil started slipping. I think that requires really strong fingers.

[JohnR725]

10 hours ago, HectorLooi said:

I watched Alex putting in a "T" ended spring last night. He used a brass rod to move the "T" into the slot by pushing against it until the whole coil started slipping. I think that requires really strong fingers.

what's interesting in watch repair is there's more than one way of doing things. I think there's a better way to do this. Because pushing the spring in after the fact does require really strong fingers can scratch up the inside of the barrel and sometimes it just doesn't work. So maybe there's a better way just a little modification to his procedure and everything would be fine.

before we get to the modification of the procedure just to see the problem. In this particular example we have an Elgin spring. It has a protruding  T and a square hole and the brace part that holds the whole thing in place.

the modification to the procedure is not to wind the entire spring into the wonder leave a little bit sticking out.  in need to leave enough to work with this might have been a little on the short side. You don't want to leave the lot out because it becomes much harder to get it into the barrel.  also pay attention to diameter the winder it has to be small enough to go in and still accommodate the mainspring that sticking out.

now comes the interesting problem of video would've been better as I don't really have enough hands to properly show this but I'll try to describe the procedure. I usually hold the barrel in my left hand and the winder in my right hand. They start by inserting the end of the spring and angle into the barrel followed by the winder itself. Once you grasp what you're doing it's really easy to do this I think it took less than five minutes to put the Elgin spring into the barrel from out of the package. It just seems confusing with the wording perhaps

now for those eagle eyed people you'll notice that doesn't quite look right? This is because I photographed three separate T type mainspring insertions and by the time I got to the Elgin I didn't  photograph everything so this happens to be a Hamilton. So basically inserted in don't worry about where it goes just get the whole thing into the barrel. Then you can rotate the handle of your winder until the tea part is over the hole or slot. then I usually use my largest screwdriver push the mainspring down verifying that it is in the slot in this case. Do not assume that it's in the whole and/or slot you have to visually verify which is why you have to pick it up and look and see yes it's where it's supposed to be.

so the key here is with a little bit a spring sticking out your rotate the winder until it's over the whole/slot then you push it in and look at the other side to make sure you see something like this. In other words the Elgin has its protruding part into the slot exactly where it's supposed to be but we can't quite push it out yet we just need to verify it is where it's supposed to be.

 now we get to one of the most important steps you can't just push the spring out and hope that's going to stay  Where it currently is it will probably jump out. This is where the back end of your tweezers would work or I usually use my largest screwdriver. basically going to put pressure on the protruding part that sticking up and hold it in place. Now you can push the spring out when you're holding it in place and it will stay where it is.

 then of course once the spring is out you do want to make sure that it actually did stay word supposed to be I don't recall ever having it jump out so but still you want to check. Also into putting the lid on of course make sure that you align it with the part that sticking up.

 

[HectorLooi]

I did try this method on a Russian watch before but somehow the T end still managed to jump out of the slot.

I'll have to try this again later this week.

[JohnR725]

4 minutes ago, HectorLooi said:

somehow the T end still managed to jump out of the slot.

I don't ever recall having that problem.that it hasn't happened perhaps. But you do want to make sure that the mainspring is identical to the one you're replacing and that it actually does fit the whole/slot. When I was photographing the three main Springs I was doing the original Hamilton I struggled for quite a long time just because the T didn't want to go into the hole at all. There is no way as going to push it out until it would actually go into the hole. often times with T ends the replacement may be bigger or shaped a little different than the original. Or like in the Hamilton with the picture below the riveted tea party is on the wrong side of the mainspring. So basically is not a drop in place because a whole isn't in the right place for the replacement mainspring. Then the tea party didn't stick up high enough so I had to hold it a little differently I wasn't happy with that. The other two mainsprings the Elgin which I have pictured above was textbook perfect but they Hamilton was a nightmare which was also probably because I had to basically identical springs to do and they both did the same thing

replacement not identical to the original which is currently on the outside and the replacement is on the inside.

alternative way of holding the spring in place. I suspect that the replacement spring is slightly narrower in addition to the end not being quite right which is why I can't use my normal method of holding it in place. Instead is even CM pushing almost straight down with the flat part of the screwdriver which did work.

here you can see an example of I don't think it was as tall as it should've been the T part should definitely be higher up. Almost was invisible on the other side.

then unfortunately this is watch repair it be really nice to say that only one method is perfect and it works every single time and no it doesn't. Which is why we have alternative methods of doing things but for the most part I don't have a problem inserting mainsprings this way at least if I can get it into the winder. Which is why we have multiple of different sets of winders at work and they occasionally it still has to be hand wound in.

 

[HectorLooi]

Hi @JohnR725, I tried the "leaving the tail outside method" and I just couldn't get the T into the slot. Must be the same problem as the Hamilton. 

Then I tried Alex's method of pushing the T with a brass tool. And I was shocked by how easily the entire coil of mainspring was able to turn inside the barrel. It went in with no problem. 

I'll keep both methods in mind. You'll never know which method would work better on a different watch.

Edited May 9, 2023 by HectorLooi
Typo

[HectorLooi]

I had another go at using the "leaving the tail outside" method. I also used the original mainspring arbor held in a pin vise to wind the spring into a suitable size winder. 

Initially, I just used the arbor directly in the pin vise to wind the spring but the spring winds unevenly and bulged out of the gap between the winder and pin vise. 

Then I made a washer out of aluminium and put it between the arbor and the pin vise.

Then I hooked the spring on the winder and wound it like any normal winder handle.

This time I left a longer length of tail outside the winder, which made it easier to maneuver the T piece into the slot. The exercise was successful. 

After I closed up the barrel, it suddenly dawned on me that the barrel cap could have used as the washer to prevent the mainspring from twisting in the winder.

The next time I come across a mainspring which doesn't fit any of the arbors of my winders, I can use this trick to wind it.