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Croton with an ETA 2472


Razz

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My latest aquisition. Dial is pretty subtle but decent. Hands were off. Non running. Description on the lot did not have info on the movement.  20 to 30 minutes to remove the dial and put back on with reattached hands. Messed around with the automatic winding and fiddled with it until a very low beat on the balance for about 20 to 30 seconds. So another project to step up a level to an automatic with calendar. Will need to get the lube for the automatic gears though first.1702834031_DSCN51672.thumb.JPG.585c9bc04bedca3688ef035ba6e8196f.JPG500568425_DSCN51682.thumb.JPG.4ef3baa6ae790a9f921a1231f01bfbf5.JPG1150977894_DSCN51692.thumb.JPG.167c4a49bc0ea9faf7348ad2ccef5ae0.JPG1305144513_DSCN51702.thumb.JPG.b914e4222bbf3b6345102876ec517bd8.JPG2114352391_DSCN51712.thumb.JPG.d484c046628794865be6a16f3cbcbf03.JPG

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  • 2 weeks later...

Great movement, I have one on my wrist at the moment 😄 make sure to check out this walkthrough if you haven't already: 

 

By the way, mine was also a non-runner when I got it. Turned out to be too little end-shake on the balance. The lower (mainplate) endstone assembly for the balance was quite easy to shim. Not sure if this is a common "fault" with these movements, but I'd suggest you check the endshake on the balance first. Try loosening the balance cock screw a little and see if it kicks into life.

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4 hours ago, fellerts said:
4 hours ago, fellerts said:

The lower (mainplate) endstone assembly for the balance was quite easy to shim.

Do you mean that you made the cap jewel thinner? Maybe not. Anyway, I'd really like to hear more about it!

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16 hours ago, VWatchie said:

Do you mean that you made the cap jewel thinner? Maybe not. Anyway, I'd really like to hear more about it!

Oh no, that would be way outside my comfort zone! I simply unscrewed the disk that holds the cap jewel assembly and shimmed it with a couple pieces of thin foil. Shimming the balance cock would probably have worked as well, but I believe it would have been more difficult due to its geometry. Side-note: Do you know why the lower assembly is held in place by a disk such as this?

image.png.bcfa8d659f4d7490bed9c7268cefb3d5.png

The leading theory is that the balance was replaced at some point, and that the new balance staff was slightly longer than the original one, but it's hard to be sure. Anyway the movement runs with ridiculous amplitude now - well in excess of 330 degrees DU/DD, and it does knock a bit at full wind when I move my arm too much. Maybe someone replaced its spring with a slightly stronger one to combat the binding balance? I should inspect the mainspring again... one day! There are too many projects on my bench.

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20 hours ago, fellerts said:

I simply unscrewed the disk that holds the cap jewel assembly and shimmed it with a couple pieces of thin foil

That's very interesting, thanks, and reminds me very much of the Russian approach (Vostok, Raketa, Poljot, etc.) where you'll most often find one or two shims under the balance cock. I would have thought thin foil (I assume you mean aluminium foil!?) to be too tick, but perhaps it's an ideal material. Got so curious I'll measure a bit of aluminium foil right now. Back in a minute...

IMG_0001.thumb.JPG.c8021e1dea806587c5cb2b778c33d91e.JPG

This is the aluminium foil I found in my kitchen drawer and it's 1/100 mm. So, pretty ideal I'd say. One or two shims would in most cases, I believe, be enough to make the necessary adjustment.

20 hours ago, fellerts said:

Do you know why the lower assembly is held in place by a disk such as this?

I'm afraid I have no idea.

20 hours ago, fellerts said:

Anyway the movement runs with ridiculous amplitude now - well in excess of 330 degrees DU/DD, and it does knock a bit at full wind when I move my arm too much. Maybe someone replaced its spring with a slightly stronger one to combat the binding balance? I should inspect the mainspring again...

Or, perhaps, oil the pallet fork jewels with a bit of thick oil (HP-1300)?!

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4 hours ago, VWatchie said:

the Russian approach (Vostok, Raketa, Poljot, etc.) where you'll most often find one or two shims under the balance cock.

I've heard that as well, though I still haven't worked on anything Russian yet.

 

4 hours ago, VWatchie said:

This is the aluminium foil I found in my kitchen drawer and it's 1/100 mm. So, pretty ideal I'd say. One or two shims would in most cases, I believe, be enough to make the necessary adjustment.

Jealous of your micrometer there... And yes, I used two tiny strips of basic aluminium foil for this.

 

4 hours ago, VWatchie said:

Or, perhaps, oil the pallet fork jewels with a bit of thick oil (HP-1300)?!

I did play around with adding some D5 to the pivots which seems to reduce amplitude by around 30 degrees after a short test. This might be a viable solution, but I'll have to let it run for a week or so to be sure.

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 4/14/2023 at 6:39 AM, fellerts said:

Great movement, I have one on my wrist at the moment 😄 make sure to check out this walkthrough if you haven't already: 

 

By the way, mine was also a non-runner when I got it. Turned out to be too little end-shake on the balance. The lower (mainplate) endstone assembly for the balance was quite easy to shim. Not sure if this is a common "fault" with these movements, but I'd suggest you check the endshake on the balance first. Try loosening the balance cock screw a little and see if it kicks into life.

I tried to loosen the balance cock screw a bit without much success. So decided to clean and oil the balance jewels to see if that would help. I opened the balance cock incabloc spring easy enough and got the end stone  jewel and chaton out okay and put in an acetone rinse. I then tried to get the end stone off the chaton and it was stuck! I tried soaking over night and still would not come apart. I finally used a new balance pivot to push the end stone off to clean and oil and put back together. Had to repeat the process for the end stone and chaton on the plate under the dial. I think with these 2 now a little more flexible under the spring and not jammed into the chaton this gave a little endshake and runs great now.

With an all SS case with drilled lugs, original dial and hands this looks pretty good, without doing much more than an ultrasonic cleaning of the case.

I wonder what the CHP is about. I was thinking maybe California Highway Patrol...lol. maybe ponch (Erik Estrada) wore it during filming of the TV show. Anyways another look at it.906907024_20230510_1948152.thumb.jpg.31a5f6cc43e188e665b1ad600cce1e7d.jpg233118540_20230510_1948272.thumb.jpg.1603fd7c89fc5ced256a3372cfda92a4.jpg1481918069_20230510_1955562.thumb.jpg.6ef2a2dde96d559df78b6352bfcdcf4c.jpg

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