Did I just buy a Franken watch?

[VWatchie]

I've been looking for an inexpensive watch housing an ETA 2892-A2 for quite a while, and tonight I found such a watch on eBay with minutes remaining on the auction. So, no time for any kind of research before pulling the trigger. Here it is:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/115416828735?nma=true&si=TU6fBYCckx%2BDrhsxhsi16HQPaig%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

Now that I Google the reference number, Hamilton 9721B, all examples coming up have an ETA 2824. Also, when looking at the movement through the see-through case back (as seen in one of the pictures), it is obvious that the rotor lacks the Hamilton logo. I'm beginning to get the feeling I might have bought a Franken watch. What do you think?

[seadwellermike]

That’s a sharp piece for sure! I authenticate and purchase luxury time pieces for a living, and am an avid collector, and while my qualifications apply mostly to other types, this watch’s rotor could very well be engraved and not be visible since the photos is so poor. 
 

meaning, many of these watches have the HAMILTON word engraved but bad lighting can hide it EASILY. Making it completely invisible in a photo. 
 

also, if the movement were replaced (or just the rotor, etc) and is genuine ETA you are still in good shape. Wait until you get it and can truly inspect. It’s worth the money regardless. 

[gbyleveldt]

Nice watch VW, I’m a sucker for field watches and a Khaki is the epitome of that. Even if it turns out to have a swapped movement you still have a very nice piece there

Edited June 12, 2022 by gbyleveldt

[Nucejoe]

Asking price is about the same as a brand new west end watch, that come in SS steel case. 

See photo.

https://www.chrono24.com/all/west-end-watch-co-automatic-day-date---red-dial---men---1960-1969-vintage--id21272721.htm#gref

West end watches are popular in my neck of the woods. I am sure I can find a good used  one for  £3 give or take a buck.

Shipping though is crazy expensive here, $48 or so. 

Look up west end watches on the net.

[VWatchie]

3 hours ago, seadwellermike said:

That’s a sharp piece for sure! I authenticate and purchase luxury time pieces for a living

Well, that was a relief to hear. Thank you very much!

3 hours ago, seadwellermike said:

Wait until you get it and can truly inspect.

I'll do that and report back.

3 hours ago, seadwellermike said:

It’s worth the money regardless.

I was the only bidder so I got it for the asking price ($230).

[VWatchie]

I took a closer look at the description of this listing and found this “reassuring” info:

“original Hamiton swiss automatic movement ETA 2892-A2, 39mm with crown, sapphire crystal”

Also, the seller has 100 % positive feedback and has been an eBay seller since 2011.

All in all it looks pretty good so I wouldn’t be surprised if you are spot on@seadwellermike. Again thanks!

[Paul80]

Its on ebay, so its bound to have a hidden history that the seller may not even be aware of, but you might be lucky.

I normally buy Seiko and Citizen watches and just about every single one from eBay has not been as cosher as implied by the seller, they of course may be just as ignorant of the watches history as I was looking at pictures.

Fortunatly I buy cheap watches to practice on so detecting a hint of curry when the back is removed because it was once a Mumbi Special is not a big issue to me but if I was spending hundreds or thousands I would not be best pleased.  Had one the other day described as just stopped working spares and repairs only so no comeback when I opened it I found the just stopped working was because the Pallet fork was missing, fortunatly it was under a tenner so no big issue and its now stripped in the spares pile as I am bound to need a part from it sooner than later.

 

[VWatchie]

1 hour ago, Paul80 said:

Its on ebay, so its bound to have a hidden history that the seller may not even be aware of, but you might be lucky.

Paying $230 for a used Hamilton Khaki housing an ETA 2892-A2 I'm expecting (or hoping) for a well-used but intact watch with poor performance. I'll just have to wait and see.

 

2 hours ago, Paul80 said:

I normally buy Seiko and Citizen watches and just about every single one from eBay has not been as cosher as implied by the seller, they of course may be just as ignorant of the watches history as I was looking at pictures.

You're absolutely right about that, and the same goes for 99 % of all used Russian watches. They're "always" listed as "serviced" but never are, or dipped in a can of naphtha, blow off with a hair-drier and then some sewing machine or olive oil injected here and there. Anyway, that's what I want for practice.

2 hours ago, Paul80 said:

when I opened it I found the just stopped working was because the Pallet fork was missing,

 Yeah, pallet forks are known for just evaporating in those Mumbi specials!

[anilv]

The rotor and the mounting for the rotor beaing is typical for the 2892. It is not much in use by the fakers so you should be safe.

Having said that, Hamilton has been reduced to a designer brand but here at least they seem to be using a decent movement.

Anilv

[Karon]

If you are unsure whether you have purchased a Franken watch, please contact a trusted watchmaker to verify the authenticity of the watch and its components. Franken watches can be a source of frustration for collectors, as they may not function properly or retain their value over time.

[RichardHarris123]

What did you find @VWatchie ?

[VWatchie]

3 hours ago, RichardHarris123 said:

What did you find @VWatchie ?

Thanks for asking and reminding me to return to this thread!

What I found was a decent movement (although somewhat rusty around the keyless works) in dire need of a service. The Hamilton brand name was to be found nowhere on the movement when I took it apart. The inside of the case back was stamped "Made in Hong Kong" but the back of the dial was stamped "Swiss-made". It's difficult to tell whether it is an official Hamilton or some sort of Franken. Everything feels like it's good quality and the case even has drilled lugs, but I haven't seen any other Hamilton Khaki housing an ETA 2892-A2 movement.

If you want to get close and personal with the movement in this watch you can check out my service walkthrough of it.