Balance Holder Tool

[HectorLooi]

I bought this balance holder tool from AliExpress a couple of months ago. I thought that it would be handy for holding the balance while adjusting the hairspring collet to correct beat error.

But it turned out to be rubbish. The tack is so short that there isn't enough space to reach the collet.

I thought of shortening the height of the table but that would be quite a bit of work to execute it properly.

Then it hit me this morning.

 

 I simply extended the balance tack with a brass PCB standoff. It also solved the problem of a wobbly tack when the standoff is tightened.

 

[watchweasol]

Hi Hector  I saw these on the bay and wonered about them, as they support the balance whilst under inspection/repair and take the strain off the spring.  I thought the knurled post was adjustable in height but obiously not. I like your mod simple soloution to the problem

[Neverenoughwatches]

6 minutes ago, watchweasol said:

Hi Hector  I saw these on the bay and wonered about them, as they support the balance whilst under inspection/repair and take the strain off the spring.  I thought the knurled post was adjustable in height but obiously not. I like your mod simple soloution to the problem

Hi ww. Hope you are well. Was just browsing the forum looking for relavent information. Can I ask your method of collet adjustment, I do have a way that seems to work well, although a little risky. I think I also have so e obscure tool that I think was used for collet adjustment but it seem to be more of a faff than anything 

Edited April 21, 2022 by Neverenoughwatches

[watchweasol]

Hi NeverE  A good morning to you Sunny day in Scotland.  I used to use a screw driver to turn the collet. A menber had problens doing the same and I made him some tools to do the job , never got round to making myself some though.  They were made from the thin steel from wiper blades cut and shaped to slide in under the cock but you need to be careful.

[Neverenoughwatches]

5 hours ago, HectorLooi said:

I bought this balance holder tool from AliExpress a couple of months ago. I thought that it would be handy for holding the balance while adjusting the hairspring collet to correct beat error.

But it turned out to be rubbish. The tack is so short that there isn't enough space to reach the collet.

I thought of shortening the height of the table but that would be quite a bit of work to execute it properly.

Then it hit me this morning.

 

 I simply extended the balance tack with a brass PCB standoff. It also solved the problem of a wobbly tack when the standoff is tightened.

 

 

1 minute ago, watchweasol said:

Hi NeverE  A good morning to you Sunny day in Scotland.  I used to use a screw driver to turn the collet. A menber had problens doing the same and I made him some tools to do the job , never got round to making myself some though.  They were made from the thin steel from wiper blades cut and shaped to slide in under the cock but you need to be careful.

Oh love Scotland especially  Edinburgh. My wife is part Scottish, and red haired,  which makes her double  quite the handful at times. But beautiful inside and out just the same. So would you do your adjustment on a tack or another way. I flip the cock on its back onto some rodico, then carefully lift the bal. wheel up and slide a driver in-between the hairspring.  I'm not keen on using a tack, I don't like the spring having to take the weight of the wheel for too long. What do you think

[VWatchie]

The safest and easiest way to adjust the collet I learned from the following post (2nd paragraph) by @nickelsilver.

 

[Neverenoughwatches]

22 minutes ago, VWatchie said:

The safest and easiest way to adjust the collet I learned from the following post (2nd paragraph) by @nickelsilver.

 

Now then vw how you doin? That sounds similar to the way I use. I Like to stick the cock down to stop it moving around it's pretty quick that way to do. Did you see the tool I posted yesterday. # What is it #. Someone helped me I'd. It . I think it's a very old simple version  of that same tool nicklesilver has

[HectorLooi]

55 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

 

Oh love Scotland especially  Edinburgh. My wife is part Scottish, and red haired,  which makes her double  quite the handful at times. But beautiful inside and out just the same. So would you do your adjustment on a tack or another way. I flip the cock on its back onto some rodico, then carefully lift the bal. wheel up and slide a driver in-between the hairspring.  I'm not keen on using a tack, I don't like the spring having to take the weight of the wheel for too long. What do you think

That is the reason for having an adjustable table. It is raised to support the spring so that it doesn't dangle until it distorts.

In that same thread that @VWatchie mentioned, I showed the tool that I use on larger movements. For smaller movements, I just stick an old oiler in the collet and turn it.

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 minute ago, HectorLooi said:

That is the reason for having an adjustable table. It is raised to support the spring so that it doesn't dangle until it distorts.

In that same thread that @VWatchie mentioned, I showed the tool that I use on larger movements. For smaller movements, I just stick an old oiler in the collet and turn it.

Thanks Hector, mine doesn't  have the table and I really hate to see the balance wheel pulling down on the spring. I used to put a prop underneath to support it. But it was a bit of messing around so I've just resorted to flipping the cock over on its back and let the staff just sit in the top jewel. It just seems a safer method for me and a lot quicker.

[HectorLooi]

I only use my balance tack to hold watch hands when applying lume.

[Neverenoughwatches]

17 minutes ago, HectorLooi said:

That is the reason for having an adjustable table. It is raised to support the spring so that it doesn't dangle until it distorts.

In that same thread that @VWatchie mentioned, I showed the tool that I use on larger movements. For smaller movements, I just stick an old oiler in the collet and turn it.

Oh and I forgot to mention that my tack is a toothpick stuck in a piece of bluetack. This is the reality of my DIY watch repair make do tool world lol

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 minute ago, HectorLooi said:

I only use my balance tack to hold watch hands when applying lume.

Thats a bloody good idea HectorLooi, I'll keep that tip In my arsenal if you don't mind when I try reluming . I now need another tub of toothpicks

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, watchweasol said:

Hi NeverE  A good morning to you Sunny day in Scotland.  I used to use a screw driver to turn the collet. A menber had problens doing the same and I made him some tools to do the job , never got round to making myself some though.  They were made from the thin steel from wiper blades cut and shaped to slide in under the cock but you need to be careful.

Just out of curiosity ww. When you worked in Hull you said it was for East Yorkshire motors. Did you mean Yorkshire buses ?

[VWatchie]

10 hours ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Now then vw how you doin?

Like nickelsilver described it. To make sure I'll quote the paragraphs I was referring to.

"For every day work, from the smallest ladies movements to marine chronometer, I set the balance with the cock on a bench block so the roller table is in a hole, balance on the block. Lift up the cock and move it over- not flipping it, just moving laterally, until I can see the slot in the hairspring collet, get in there and adjust (for tiny watches this is usually with an oiler, larger, a small screwdriver). Go back in the watch and check on the machine."

"I do the adjustment under the microscope, which is pretty essential as the adjustment is usually very very small. I hold a balance arm of the rim with tweezers while moving the collet."

~@nickelsilver

[Neverenoughwatches]

16 minutes ago, VWatchie said:

Like nickelsilver described it. To make sure I'll quote the paragraphs I was referring to.

"For every day work, from the smallest ladies movements to marine chronometer, I set the balance with the cock on a bench block so the roller table is in a hole, balance on the block. Lift up the cock and move it over- not flipping it, just moving laterally, until I can see the slot in the hairspring collet, get in there and adjust (for tiny watches this is usually with an oiler, larger, a small screwdriver). Go back in the watch and check on the machine."

"I do the adjustment under the microscope, which is pretty essential as the adjustment is usually very very small. I hold a balance arm of the rim with tweezers while moving the collet."

~@nickelsilver

I know I'm terrible at quoting paragraphs. I also reply to myself, I'm getting  there slowly, very slowly lol. Stop picking on me , I'm not the only one that does it. And I also have a small phone and big fingers it's not my fault. Excuses excuses.

[Neverenoughwatches]

21 minutes ago, VWatchie said:

Like nickelsilver described it. To make sure I'll quote the paragraphs I was referring to.

"For every day work, from the smallest ladies movements to marine chronometer, I set the balance with the cock on a bench block so the roller table is in a hole, balance on the block. Lift up the cock and move it over- not flipping it, just moving laterally, until I can see the slot in the hairspring collet, get in there and adjust (for tiny watches this is usually with an oiler, larger, a small screwdriver). Go back in the watch and check on the machine."

"I do the adjustment under the microscope, which is pretty essential as the adjustment is usually very very small. I hold a balance arm of the rim with tweezers while moving the collet."

~@nickelsilver

Yup. That's exactly  how I do it. At least I'm doin somefing right then.

[rodabod]

I quite like the look of that tool and may get one to modify. 
 

I’m still surprised at the number of people who are paranoid about deforming hairsprings by suspending the balance wheel by the spring. In my experience, there are few balances which are heavy enough to cause damage if you handle them carefully. 

[Neverenoughwatches]

13 minutes ago, rodabod said:

I quite like the look of that tool and may get one to modify. 
 

I’m still surprised at the number of people who are paranoid about deforming hairsprings by suspending the balance wheel by the spring. In my experience, there are few balances which are heavy enough to cause damage if you handle them carefully. 

Hi Rodabod. My reasoning was from dealing with an old oris. The spring was an old carbon very fatigued spring that really stretched under the weight of the wheel. Really needed replacing bit I was trying to keep as original  as possible. 

[VWatchie]

8 hours ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

I know I'm terrible at quoting paragraphs. I also reply to myself, I'm getting  there slowly, very slowly lol. Stop picking on me

No worries! The only reason I cited manually is that sometimes the links don't seem to work, or confuse, at least myself 

[Neverenoughwatches]

2 minutes ago, VWatchie said:

No worries! The only reason I cited manually is that sometimes the links don't seem to work, or confuse, at least myself 

Morning matey. I can't work out how to pick specific sentences 

[Tiny]

is this tool really needed when you dismantle a movement for cleaning ?

[Neverenoughwatches]

5 minutes ago, Tiny said:

is this tool really needed when you dismantle a movement for cleaning ?

What tool Tiny ?

[Tiny]

sorry the tool thats quoted in this post 

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 minute ago, Tiny said:

sorry the tool thats quoted in this post 

Nooooooooo. Not in our world mate, we not that professional. 

3 minutes ago, Tiny said:

sorry the tool thats quoted in this post 

Looks nice Sat on your bench though.  Read back a little .

[Tiny]

So is it ok to just place it in a tray until it's time to fit it back into the watch.