ETA 2789-1

[ifibrin]

5 hours ago, rossjackson01 said:

Wow! What a learning curve. 3 strip downs. Could not get the wheels to turn. Finally, after watching a video a number of times I realised that I was not getting the click to be operated on the crown wheel which is on the barrel spring. I had just been placing the crown wheel onto the barrel. No adjustment to make the click operate. Aagh! All the videos of this particular movement are accompanied with music. No verbal's. Got there. The main spring now winds. I can move the Pallet fork and the escapement operates. 

As a novice. It is such a sense of achievement. Felt I had to tell you all. Sorry to be a bore.

Regards

Ross

We’ve all been in that position. The sense of excitement is out of this world… as well as the feeling of dread when a part flies off and you spend hours on your knees searching for it on the floor.

[rossjackson01]

3 hours ago, ifibrin said:

The sense of excitement is out of this world… as well as the feeling of dread when a part flies off and you spend hours on your knees searching for it on the floor.

The first day of my watch repair, this watch, I lost 2 items. My bride found them 2 days later.  To overcome that problem, as a result from a comment from a member, I purchased a small plastic container from a local supermarket. Spent a few minutes cutting out the front, leaving a lip. I used an old laptop case as the base. 

Since install, I think I have have in excess of 20 'pings' on the side walls. A frantic look in the box has been successful on every occasion. Whew!

I also place every item in small containers.

I don't have much space as can be seen. Tools by the computer, watch box against the wall. I store the working box on the printer when not watch repairing. I can look at the computer when repairing. Thank goodness for YouTube.

Thank you to all

Regards

Ross

[VWatchie]

On 3/2/2022 at 4:57 PM, rossjackson01 said:

Looking a the cog part at the top. I notice that the cog does not actually sit in the gem. It looks flat at the top. Is there supposed to be a point?, that inserts into the gem.

EDIT: Oops, didn't realize I wasn't on the last page...

Absolutely! The pivot has been broken off (sensitive little buggers, oftentimes only having a diameter of about 0.1 mm) You'll have to source an intact escape wheel.

Edited April 1, 2022 by VWatchie

[rossjackson01]

59 minutes ago, VWatchie said:

Absolutely! The pivot has been broken off (sensitive little buggers, oftentimes only having a diameter of about 0.1 mm) You'll have to source an intact escape wheel.

VWatchie.

Done as suggested. Twice. Inexperience ruled.

Regards

Ross

[rossjackson01]

Well, this watch keeps giving, NOT.

I can place the balance and bridge into the pivot. After gently touching, It oscillates very slowly, about 3 per second, and only to 120 degrees. I tighten the screw and it stops.  Been at it over 2 hours. Any comments would be appreciated. 

Thank you 

Ross

[Nucejoe]

21 minutes ago, rossjackson01 said:

 tighten the screw and it stops. 

Sounds like there is no end shake on balance staff ( staff's axial end play), in which case end stones push on pivot ends and stop the balance.

Try shimming up the cock to create some end shake, ideal end shake is .02mm or less not including zero.

 

 

[rossjackson01]

6 hours ago, Nucejoe said:

Try shimming up the cock to create some end shake, ideal end shake is .02mm or less not including zero.

Thank you Nucejoe.

Does that mean, in layman speak. A shim of metal should be inserted under the balance bridge to raise it. Can shims be purchased? Could the shim be, a piece of an old spring, a washer?

Thank you in anticipation

Ross

[Nucejoe]

A 1×3 mm piece of aluminum foil, placed under the inner side of the cock, is a good start. 

Good luck 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[rossjackson01]

Tried a shim. Did not work. When bridge is place, tightened or not, the balance only spins for about 30 seconds then stops. I have tried 3 pallet forks. Same thing with all. 

Depressed

Ross

[Nucejoe]

6 hours ago, rossjackson01 said:

Tried a shim. Did not work. When bridge is place, tightened or not, the balance only spins for about 30 seconds then stops. I have tried 3 pallet forks. Same thing with all. 

Depressed

Ross

Could be a bent pivot then. 

[watchweasol]

Hi Ross to eliminate the rest of the parts remove balance and fork and check the train is free, then fit the fork and add a bit of power is the fork flipping from one banking  to the other when moved, it should be a snap action if ok fit the balance and re try if same remove balance and fork and just fit th balance and puff with the blower does it move freely and oscilate for some time, If so we are looking at checking the balance spring for  concentricity and flat ness and also for the beat error. If its a long way out it will never start.  with no power on the watch check the alignment of the fork , inpulse pin and the position of the fork between the bankings. I should rest in the center.

[ifibrin]

I would check the pivots of all the train wheels and balance wheel. 

[Nucejoe]

12 hours ago, rossjackson01 said:

the balance only spins for about 30 seconds then stops. 

Do you mean " the balance spin for 30 seconds"   or movements runs for 30 seconds then stops.

My take was , when you have only the balance&cock on the mainplate. 

If the movement runs for only 30 seconds, its what weasol says.

 

 

[rossjackson01]

All wheels work freely. Everything seems free. Movement runs. 30 seconds then stops. I noticed that the balance hairspring seems to be 'touching' when oscillating. I touched the balance surround with my tweezers. The movement ran for 1 hour then stopped. I touched it again and it has not worked since. The hairspring looks 'wrong'. Lack of skill appears to have knackered the balance. Don't have the skill to repair the balance. May have to delay any further work until I can get a replacement part.

I'm getting really good and wrecking balances and escapements. 

Not stopping practicing though.

Regards

Ross

Edited April 7, 2022 by rossjackson01
grammar

[watchweasol]

Hi Ross  can you post some close ups of the balance and spring we may be able to help.  Balance spring diagnosis and adjustment is all part of the watch repair life style.

[rossjackson01]

As requested

[rossjackson01]

It's not often you lot are wrong. BUT YOU ARE RIGHT AGAIN. The balance wheel was not revolving. I removed the bridge and notice that the 3rd wheel did not connect with 2nd wheel. I have stripped down the train of wheels and will start again.  I still think the balance is not OK as it does not rotate.

Ross

[watchweasol]

Hi Ross when you get the balance out post some pictures of it top bottom pivots and the spring its self, good man for finding the fault with the train,we are nearly there now.  when you put the train wheels and bridga on check the rotation ie ( with the watch minus the fork) put a couple of turns on the spring, the wheels will run down and the ecsape wheel will reverse a little at the end. Once accomplished then fit the fork and check its action must be snappy under power, then the balance goes in.  If you wish before the fork goes in fit the balance and give it a puff of air and check the rotation and the contricity and flatness of the spring in the free state.

[mikepilk]

I have one of these movements in my collection - I wanted one as it's a "high end" ETA movement.

I was surprised at how "flimsy" the movement is compared to other ETA models - the mainplate and bridges seem much thinner, than say as 2836. 

My movement had signs of someone heavy handed having a go - the mainplate was distorted in the centre.

Have you checked that all the bridges/cocks sit correctly and the gear train has sufficient endshake throughout  ?

[rossjackson01]

Ticking, ticking, ticking, ticking, ticking ....

Thank you, Thank you, Thank you. 

You are not going to believe it. When I damaged the escape wheels (yes, plural), I obtained replacements which included a pallet fork. I used these new pallet forks. They were the problem. The replacements were for an ETA 2789. Supposed to be identical with the ETA 2789-1. They're not. I put the old pallet fork with the replacement escape wheel. Still ticking in any position. Woohoo! 

Job tomorrow is the calendar side. 

 

[watchweasol]

Crack on Ross    onward and upward.

[Nucejoe]

39 minutes ago, rossjackson01 said:

 The replacements were for an ETA 2789. Supposed to be identical with the ETA 2789-1. They're not. I put the old pallet fork with the replacement escape wheel. Still ticking in any position. Woohoo! 

Congrat Ross.

 The two movements differ in complicarions only, thence the thickness and so on.

I bet pallets of the replacement fork needed adjustment, the old one worked  because it was already adjusted.

 

 

[rossjackson01]

11 minutes ago, Nucejoe said:

I bet pallets of the replacement fork needed adjustment, the old one worked  because it was already adjusted.

Adjusted? How is that done? Not being churlish. Genuine request for information. They appear so small. At this time of my learning cycle I am genuinely interested.

Regards

Ross 

[Nucejoe]

4 minutes ago, rossjackson01 said:

Adjusted? How is that done? Not being churlish. Genuine request for information. They appear so small. At this time of my learning cycle I am genuinely interested.

Regards

 

 Its about moving pallets inward and outward in the fork slot, so to optimize  the  impulse  deilvered to the impulse jewel.

 There has been many discusion on the subject with pictures illustrating details, with Swiss lever the need for adjusting pallets is significant, the task involves dealing with the" lock"  run to the drop " and " drop"  at the right instance, also  issue of overbanming is of concern.

I'd say at this point you best practice with clean&lube and regulating of a movement, hopefully you will soon be ready to step in the mind field called pallet adjustment.

Regards 

 

[rossjackson01]

Nucejoe

Thank you for your kind comments. I think that pallet adjustment will be light years away for me. I ordered my first tools on 17 December 2021. Youtube was my lesson forum until January 2022 when I opened my first watch. All the watches I purchased or practiced with, were like this one. In need of repair. Parts broken. As a novice, it's been a high, slow, learning curve. But ever so enjoyable..

And... today I actually felt that I archived the accolade accredited in this forum. I'm a 'Watch Enthusiast'. Woohoo!

Regards to you, and all who have assisted.

More update will follow when I carry on tomorrow. Youtube rules! Really looking forward to it.

Ross