Your opinion on this west end watch

[Nucejoe]

Its a west end watch, will know about its caliber tomorrow.

Is this a roskopf type movement?     

Solid silver case.

Jewels look like American made.

Any idea how much should I pay for it.

TIA

 

[Graziano]

Hi Nucejoe, that movement looks quality with screwed jewels and bridge finishings, does it have a lever Escapement? Have seen Westend pocket watches for sale from $150 to $2000 depending on the quality and rare factor. 

[Nucejoe]

4 minutes ago, Graziano said:

Hi Nucejoe, that movement looks quality with screwed jewels and bridge finishings, does it have a lever Escapement? Have seen Westend pocket watches for sale from $150 to $2000 depending on the quality and rare factor. 

Yes its swiss lever.  

I  think it might be a railroad grade, you are right looks good grade, big watch.

priced at 400 USD.

Thanks for your response

[JohnR725]

To me the movement looks cheap very cheap. It looks like a counterfeit American movement. Yes they really did Make imitation American pocket watches or make watches that were supposed to be American pocket watches way back when.

3 hours ago, Nucejoe said:

Is this a roskopf type movement? 

Attached to that question I have a link.

https://www.worthpoint.com/articles/jewelry/history-roskopf-watch

Then it looks like I'm late to the party again as this answer was started before the reply just above. But even though you paid 400 I still think it looks cheap. Doesn't mean it's not a collectors item. Looking on eBay I see one that looks similar came from the UK and it went for $100. Unfortunately the ones on eBay at least the ones I looked at we do not get the see the movement.

Out of curiosity how do you know The case is made of silver?

 

[Nucejoe]

13 minutes ago, JohnR725 said:

To me the movement looks cheap very cheap. It looks like a counterfeit American movement. Yes they really did Make imitation American pocket watches or make watches that were supposed to be American pocket watches way back when.

Attached to that question I have a link.

https://www.worthpoint.com/articles/jewelry/history-roskopf-watch

Then it looks like I'm late to the party again as this answer was started before the reply just above. But even though you paid 400 I still think it looks cheap. Doesn't mean it's not a collectors item. Looking on eBay I see one that looks similar came from the UK and it went for $100. Unfortunately the ones on eBay at least the ones I looked at we do not get the see the movement.

Out of curiosity how do you know The case is made of silver?

 

A jeweler will apraise the silver for a nominal fee.

I haven't bought it yet.

Thanks for your response, good to know west end counterfeits were made .

Regs 

Joe

[KarlvonKoln]

It looks like a "Swiss Fake" which, as JohnR725 pointed out, can be fairly collectable.  EDIT: as I recall, West End Watch Co. was based out of Lancaster Pennsylvania, so reading "Swiss Made" on the dial is also why I'm guessing that.  Dollar value kinda depends on who's buying.  Not railroad grade.  Makes for an interesting rarity though.

Edited January 20, 2021 by KarlvonKoln

[Nucejoe]

13 minutes ago, KarlvonKoln said:

It looks like a "Swiss Fake" which, as JohnR725 pointed out, can be fairly collectable.  EDIT: as I recall, West End Watch Co. was based out of Lancaster Pennsylvania, so reading "Swiss Made" on the dial is also why I'm guessing that.  Dollar value kinda depends on who's buying.  Not railroad grade.  Makes for an interesting rarity though.

Thanks for your response. 

Currently west end is mainly made in India, the story goes that lord something traveled along some Asian countries and ended his trip in India, therefore the name west end watch. 

west end is also based in leytron swiss, perhaps with many subsidieries in hard to access markets.

Regs 

joe

[wls1971]

The eagle with a pocket watch in its beak is a early trade mark of the West End Watch co registered in 1885, they sold some very nice watches and are still in business today, the most sort after are the watches that used movements supplied by Longines. I have three in my collection a travel alarm with movement by Angelus, a early Hermetic cased watch from the 1920's and a Sowar.

Are there any markings on the inside of the case back or inner dust cover and outside of case back ?

A brief history of the company can be seen here:

https://www.vintagewatchstraps.com/westend.php

[Nucejoe]

4 hours ago, wls1971 said:

The eagle with a pocket watch in its beak is a early trade mark of the West End Watch co registered in 1885, they sold some very nice watches and are still in business today, the most sort after are the watches that used movements supplied by Longines. I have three in my collection a travel alarm with movement by Angelus, a early Hermetic cased watch from the 1920's and a Sowar.

Are there any markings on the inside of the case back or inner dust cover and outside of case back ?

A brief history of the company can be seen here:

https://www.vintagewatchstraps.com/westend.php

Thank you wis, I was looking forward to getting your response, will  ask for and should have the photos in 7 hrs to post. 

Regs 

Joe

[JohnR725]

6 hours ago, wls1971 said:

The eagle with a pocket watch in its beak is a early trade mark of the West End Watch co registered in 1885, they sold some very nice watches and are still in business toda

I have a link to their website.

 

http://www.westendwatchco.ch/

[Nucejoe]

1 hour ago, JohnR725 said:

I have a link to their website.

 

http://www.westendwatchco.ch/

Thanks john, 

Seller is a repairman and  dealer, has never seen one like posted above. How old would estimate it.

Just received images of dust and case cover, here they are

 

[wls1971]

I think it's an entirely genuine West End Watch co watch I would put the date between 1885 and 1900 the case is solid silver and the serial numbers match the movement, there is damage to the dial and its missing the bow, but the engine turning on the cover is still in very good order and not rubbed.

Here is a similar example on ebay:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-West-End-Winding-Swiss-Made-Pocket-Watch-r995-Old-Antique/164650214052?hash=item2655eae2a4:g:HgIAAOSw0~de5k6R

They are asking £199.00 which I doubt they will get I would think its worth between £60.00 and £80.00

[Nucejoe]

2 minutes ago, wls1971 said:

I think it's an entirely genuine West End Watch co watch I would put the date between 1885 and 1900 the case is solid silver and the serial numbers match the movement, there is damage to the dial and its missing the bow, but the engine turning on the cover is still in very good order and not rubbed.

Here is a similar example on ebay:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-West-End-Winding-Swiss-Made-Pocket-Watch-r995-Old-Antique/164650214052?hash=item2655eae2a4:g:HgIAAOSw0~de5k6R

They are asking £199.00 which I doubt they will get I would think its worth between £60.00 and £80.00

Thank you Wis, appreciate you putting in the time to do this.

Regs 

Joe

[Nucejoe]

Photo of the keyless

[Nucejoe]

Finally a crystal was cut and shaped for it ( inexpensive custom made in his shop)  , heres the finished result. 

Based on wis appraisal I am not buying this. 

[JohnR725]

8 hours ago, Nucejoe said:

Photo of the keyless

I'm willing to take the time to look up the setting parts to see if it exists in one of the older books of the fingerprint system of setting parts but I'm lazy and I won't do it unless I get a line size. The fingerprint system works best if you know what the line size of the movement. Than the problem for the older watches at least in the older book I have is that the most you might get is a name but see if the movement compares to who we think made it

11 hours ago, wls1971 said:

I think it's an entirely genuine West End Watch co watch

What's troublesome in this discussion is I thought it was a Swiss fake American pocket watch because that's what it looks like but? It turns out is made by a real company. That is not entirely a Swiss fake of an American because the fakes of American were troubling enough that the watch companies were very very unhappy because are labeled various watch company names as opposed to this kind of looking like some sort of an American watch when it's not.

[wls1971]

3 minutes ago, JohnR725 said:

What's troublesome in this discussion is I thought it was a Swiss fake American pocket watch because that's what it looks like but? It turns out is made by a real company. That is not entirely a Swiss fake of an American because the fakes of American were troubling enough that the watch companies were very very unhappy because are labeled various watch company names as opposed to this kind of looking like some sort of an American watch when it's not

The way the watch looks is entirely deliberate, its a marketing ploy of the time and some of the trademarks registered by West End Watch Co use the image of a train on the case they where for the most part sold into emerging markets like India and the far east hence the rather over the top look of the movement and that's where a lot of them turn up, the watches sold in Europe seem to be of a more traditional format and much more sober in design.

[Jalaj]

I have one WEW competition model mentioning Bombay Calcutta in 18K gold. 

[Nucejoe]

2 hours ago, Jalaj said:

I have one WEW competition model mentioning Bombay Calcutta in 18K gold. 

Hey thats a much sought after piece you got. is it subsec9nd?