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Seiko 7006A Strange Timegrapher Trace, Escape Wheel Issue?


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Hi, I think that I have an issue with the escape wheel. The periodic noise shown on the Timegrapher has a period of 5 seconds, which I believe is the time it takes for the escape wheel to rotate once. The watch has been cleaned and lubricated and is a 21 jewel 7006A and is keeping good time. I'm going to have a look at the escape wheel for issues later. Does anyone know what might cause this so I know what to look out for? Thanks in advance, Steve.

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11 minutes ago, Nucejoe said:

You have located the issue, bad escapewheel tooth?  

Personally can't see such faults unless under high magnifiction. I bet you inspect parts with an ordinary loup. 

Hi, I am new to this hobby and I am finding it very interesting and satisfying bringing old watches back to working condition. I must admit that I didn't fully inspect the escape wheel before reassembly. I do have a x20 old binocular microscope that I can have a look with. To me it appears that the issue is happening on 6 out of the 15 escape wheel teeth all next to each other on one side. Does that suggest anything to look for?

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Considering the yellow trace alone, I think you have likely correctly diagnosed the issue, since it does appear to have a period of 5s. The escapement perhaps changes phase minutely early or late on a single tooth. So perhaps you could look under high magnification as suggested and compare teeth. 
 

If the effective instantaneous beat error (if you want to call it that) is as small as it looks, then in reality it may not noticeably affect the performance. 

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9 minutes ago, steve1811uk said:

Hi, I am new to this hobby and I am finding it very interesting and satisfying bringing old watches back to working condition. I must admit that I didn't fully inspect the escape wheel before reassembly. I do have a x20 old binocular microscope that I can have a look with. To me it appears that the issue is happening on 6 out of the 15 escape wheel teeth all next to each other on one side. Does that suggest anything to look for?

Ya shows six dots in row !  Perhaps on escape pinion rather than teeth.  If a wear on pinon, sometimes I can avoid the wear by moving the pinion up or down, which is to be done by moving the jewels or their housing. We just await reinspection.

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That’s a good point about the pinion leaves. If they don’t look pristine (especially on antique watches) then I sharpen a piece of peg wood and run it up and down between the leaves. If there is corrosion then I add a tiny amount of autosol, but it must be very carefully cleaned after to avoid contamination. 

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5 minutes ago, rodabod said:

That’s a good point about the pinion leaves. If they don’t look pristine (especially on antique watches) then I sharpen a piece of peg wood and run it up and down between the leaves. If there is corrosion then I add a tiny amount of autosol, but it must be very carefully cleaned after to avoid contamination. 

Autosol ! when it comes to horol ..material, I live in fourteen century, its new parts if I can,t get inventive.

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Thanks guys for the really good tips. Well I took it apart and gave the escape wheel a rub all over with a fibre glass brush then cleaned in the ultrasonic with lighter fluid. To be honest I couldn't see anything out of the ordinary. After reassembly the periodic noise has gone. Amplitude reading is lower now but the previous reading of 285 could well have been skewed by the noise I think. Amplitude is actually on the rise, 261 as I type.

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One thing worth mentioning:  be careful in general when using a “scratch brush” as they do as the name perhaps implies, leave scratches. The escape wheel tooth tips must ideally be perfectly smooth. However, they probably still are as escape wheels are usually tempered to “glass hard”. 

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41 minutes ago, rodabod said:

One thing worth mentioning:  be careful in general when using a “scratch brush” as they do as the name perhaps implies, leave scratches. The escape wheel tooth tips must ideally be perfectly smooth. However, they probably still are as escape wheels are usually tempered to “glass hard”. 

Thanks for all the tips guys. Loving my new timegrapher, funded in the main from the sale of an old Seiko quartz 5Y23-8A11 that had sat in a drawer for most of the last 28 years.

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    • Have you ever seen grease spread?  I use Molykote DX on the keyless, cannon pinion, etc and cannot imagine it spreading. Similarly, HP1300 should not be a problem, as long as you don't splash too much about.  9010 does like to travel though. I've recently re-serviced a couple of my watches I first serviced about 5 years ago. I was a bit too liberal with the oil and grease back then, but it hasn't spread everywhere. I only epilame on balance cap stones, escape wheel and pallet stones (and auto wheels if they need it).   If you use it all over, the oil might bead-up and travel even further - think of using RainX on your car windows.
    • Polish it where the old part cracked as well. Get rid of the stress-raisers.
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    • Hello everyone, for what it's worth, here is my approach: 1. Escape wheel submerged in Epilame, then dried quickly with a hairdryer. Then the final tip of the pivots are cleaned by poking into pithwood. The logic being that the Epilame is removed at the intended contact point (to avoid any residue that may mix with the oil), but remains in the areas where oil is not supposed to spread to (further down the pivot towards the wheel). The escape wheel teeth also benefit from having Epilame to keep the 9415 in place.  2. I use a syringe to treat only the pallet stones. I suspend the pallet fork with some Rodico so that the stones hang downwards. I notably use a rather thick needle where a drop WON'T form, but rather where the Epilame liquid stays in the needle tip, which I then dip into the pallet stones. It requires some practice to get the right amount of Epilame into the needle tip, but it works for me now. This way, no drop will "jump" onto the pallet fork and potentially go all the way to the pivots.  3. I let the movement run for a few minutes without lubricating the pallet stones... to scrape off the Epilame in the intended contact "channel". Then I remove the balance again and lubricate the exit pallet stone with 3-4 successive drops. See the "channel" that forms on the pallet stone in the picture -- not so easy to see, but it's visible.       I am conflicted about the use of Epliame in balance jewel settings. My impression is that the two jewels sufficiently suspend the oil (even 9010). Apparently Rolex recommends NOT to use Epliame there (heard from a former Rolex service center watchmaker), as it could cause additional wear. Apart from that, I follow specific instructions where I can find them. E.g. the infamous Rolex reverser wheels or sometimes (parts of) the seconds wheel. Exception: I'm currently servicing an Eta 2824 and will probably ignore the service sheet that recommends treating the whole keyless works with Epilame and then using HP1300... I'll skip the Epilame and use 9504 grease.        
    • I'm going to give this a try today/tomorrow on my UTC33/Seiko 66, thanks!
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