404 Club

[rehajm]

Is it currently running? No? I’m sure Yoko broke it…

On 4/7/2023 at 11:45 AM, oldhippy said:

On those types of dials a rubber will only remove the dirt it will not harm the dial. That has come up very nicely. 

For those of us who are USA/ROW is there a standard rubber referenced for this technique? We in the states have so many erasers to choose…

…and is the technique a light rub? Dapple, roll, twist? 

 

 

Edited April 9, 2023 by rehajm

[AndyHull]

1 hour ago, RichardHarris123 said:

Probably going to cause some carfuffle but I think the Beatles were very overrated.  

Probably a cheap pin pallet but we will see. 

Yes, and yes.

[RichardHarris123]

Got this coming. 

[AndyHull]

Here's a bit of trivia for you. Spiro Agnew sued Dirty Time Corp for the Spiro Agnew watch, due to the joke that sprang up about them, namely “Did you know that Mickey Mouse wore a Spiro Agnew watch?”.
So perhaps this is actually a rip off, rather than genuine "Beatles" marketing tat.
More details about the Spiro Agnew watch -> here <-

[SpringMangler]

1 minute ago, AndyHull said:

Here's a bit of trivia for you. Spiro Agnew sued Dirty Time Corp for the Spiro Agnew watch, due to the joke that sprang up about them, namely “Did you know that Mickey Mouse wore a Spiro Agnew watch?”.
So perhaps this is actually a rip off, rather than genuine "Beatles" marketing tat.
More details about the Spiro Agnew watch -> here <-

Are these the same guys that had the Nixon watch that said "Impeachment time" on it.

[RichardHarris123]

Spyro the dragon? 

[AndyHull]

2 hours ago, SpringMangler said:

Are these the same guys that had the Nixon watch that said "Impeachment time" on it.

Not sure, but "All American Time Corp." did do this one.

Source -> https://peretiredgoodbadugly.blogspot.com/2017/10/just-like-old-days.html

Dirty Time corp did this one.

 

I may see if I can rustle up a contemporary "Trump" version.
If "The Clan" turns up at my door as a result, you may never hear from me again.

Edited April 9, 2023 by AndyHull

[AndyHull]

On 4/3/2023 at 10:12 PM, AndyHull said:

I picked up this Kienzle 058a01 based nurses fob watch, principally for the mechanism to fix a different watch, however I now have a dilemma. I like the dial on this one, so do I keep it and look for another mechanism. Do I do a swap to the other case and make a Franken-zle... any thoughts? I guess it also depends on whether the dial will fit in the case of the other watch. Its a 404 club item, so I don't feel too guilty about swapping stuff around.

I spared it the axe, and put it on a pin brooch clip from my scrap box. I may shorten the length of the tail on it slightly. It runs well, and has a nice simple Bauhaus style dial with more than a hint of the Junghans Max Bill about it. 

Edited April 10, 2023 by AndyHull

[AndyHull]

The Tavannes got temporarily re-homed in a small pocket watch case. I haven't cut the stem, and the crown doesn't really work with the case.

I'm sure I have a more suitable wristwatch case, but its probably in a large box of "stuff" which was "tidied" into the attic when we had visitors a while back.

I think It would look better in a 1930s gents wristwatch style case, but the pocket watch styling does suit the dial, and I may also have a similar but earlier small silver case in the same box of "stuff".

For the time being though, it looks a lot better than an orphaned movement in a movement storage box, and certainly a huge improvement on what we started with.

I may just run with this case for the time being, and find a suitable crown for it, and worry about it again at a later date if I ever get a chance to improve on it.

Edited April 11, 2023 by AndyHull

[spectre6000]

404 gold!

[RichardHarris123]

On 4/9/2023 at 6:45 PM, RichardHarris123 said:

Got this coming. 

It's a Cupillard 233-66, quite pleased as it's my first French movement.  Had to remove the balance to see the markings.  I hasn't struggled so much since I first began to replace it.  Not sure whether it's just me or the movement. Hehe. 

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, RichardHarris123 said:

It's a Cupillard 233-66, quite pleased as it's my first French movement.  Had to remove the balance to see the markings.  I hasn't struggled so much since I first began to replace it.  Not sure whether it's just me or the movement. Hehe. 

It must be the movement Rich,  you're dazzled by all that sparking perlage aren't you ? Come on admit it

13 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

It must be the movement Rich,  you're dazzled by all that sparking perlage aren't you ? Come on admit it

Sorry if it sounds like I'm knocking your first French movement Rich but the inside kinda reminds me of the checkerplate thats on the rear step of my van lol. 

[AndyHull]

2 hours ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

kinda reminds me of the checkerplate thats on the rear step of my van

I could do with a good non skid surface like that in some of the basket cases I deal with, since there is so much WD40 sloshing about in them, there's a real risk you might slip and break a leg.

Edited April 12, 2023 by AndyHull

[RichardHarris123]

Leave my checker plate watch alone, you bullies. Hehe. 

[AndyHull]

A 17 jewel "Cara", probably Swiss, probably Tritium lume and if so, probably 1960s.

No idea what is in it, or for that matter exactly who made it, so its another 0.99p pot luck watch.

 

@rehajm Regarding erasers.....

On 4/9/2023 at 5:59 PM, rehajm said:

For those of us who are USA/ROW is there a standard rubber referenced for this technique? We in the states have so many erasers to choose…

…and is the technique a light rub? Dapple, roll, twist?

These

Propelling pencil erasers. Just search for something like "Replacement Erasers Rubbers for Mechanical Pop Up Pencils - Refills".

Here is a UK seller with a pack of ten, and a Chinese seller with a tub of 70.

As far as I recall I bought 2 packs of 20 a while back (some of which I actually used in my propelling pencils).

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/394061043880

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/125461035012

The technique is to rub very gently, as you would when erasing a pencil mark on a delicate sheet of paper. Just enough friction to lift the dirt, and take your time. Gently does it. Cleaning the dial before hand with white vinegar and rinsing with dish soap and then clean water took off a lot of the surface dirt. The white vinegar brightens up the silvering on the dial, and in fact the gentle rubbing with the eraser brightens it some more, converting it from a sort of grey white to a shimmering burnished silvery hue (which the camera fails to do justice to). 

Edited April 12, 2023 by AndyHull

[AndyHull]

On 4/9/2023 at 6:45 PM, RichardHarris123 said:

Got this coming. 

 

I also picked up an "Ancre 15 Rubis".

This one had half a sack of potatoes and a small piece of shrapnel in it (that small round washer like widget on the mat next to it on the left).  

Maybe the shrapnel qualifies it as a "Military watch".

The scrap metal almost looks like a dial washer, but it isn't. Its made of steel, so it might be swarf from something the previous owner was working on. Whatever it is, it didn't improve the running of the thing.

It now runs, but it is a very tied movement (not sure exactly what movement it is). All of the dirt I removed had worn pretty much all of the components of the keyless works, and the barrel bearing has signs of a previous repair, so the winder feels slopy and loose. It does wind, set and run now though, which is a huge improvement on the "locked solid and filthy" state it arrived in. No doubt it is also mildly radioactive, so I have cleaned up the bench and washed my hands carefully.

I don't think it will win any beauty contests, but then again who amongst us would? The new crystal is looking a little blurry here as I was in the process of polishing it. It also got a new crown as that was missing.

Edited April 13, 2023 by AndyHull

[RichardHarris123]

4 minutes ago, AndyHull said:

 

I also picked up an "Ancre 15 Rubis".

This one had half a sack of potatoes and a small piece of shrapnel in it (that small round washer like widget on the mat next to it on the left).  

Maybe the shrapnel qualifies it as a "Military watch".

The scrap metal almost looks like a dial washer, but it isn't. Its made of steel, so it might be swarf from something the previous owner was working on. Whatever it is, it didn't improve the running of the thing.

It now runs, but it is a very tied movement. All of the dirt I removed had worn pretty much all of the components of the keyless works, and the barrel bearing has signs of a previous repair, so the winder feels slopy and loose. It does wind, set and run now though, which is a huge improvement on the "locked solid and filthy" state it arrived in. No doubt it is also mildly radioactive, so I have cleaned up the bench and washed my hands carefully.

I don't think it will win any beauty contests, but then again who amongst us would? The new crystal is looking a little blurry here as I was in the process of polishing it. It also got a new crown as that was missing.

I have several watches where I decided to be satisfied with "it's running ". Are they anyway near to perfect, no but they would need either a silly amount of money or remanufacture various parts.  Sometimes you just have to be satisfied.  

16 minutes ago, AndyHull said:

 

I also picked up an "Ancre 15 Rubis".

This one had half a sack of potatoes and a small piece of shrapnel in it (that small round washer like widget on the mat next to it on the left).  

Maybe the shrapnel qualifies it as a "Military watch".

The scrap metal almost looks like a dial washer, but it isn't. Its made of steel, so it might be swarf from something the previous owner was working on. Whatever it is, it didn't improve the running of the thing.

It now runs, but it is a very tied movement (not sure exactly what movement it is). All of the dirt I removed had worn pretty much all of the components of the keyless works, and the barrel bearing has signs of a previous repair, so the winder feels slopy and loose. It does wind, set and run now though, which is a huge improvement on the "locked solid and filthy" state it arrived in. No doubt it is also mildly radioactive, so I have cleaned up the bench and washed my hands carefully.

I don't think it will win any beauty contests, but then again who amongst us would? The new crystal is looking a little blurry here as I was in the process of polishing it. It also got a new crown as that was missing.

Which movement is it?

[Waggy]

Got a lot of 20 watches for £57.00 which equates to £2.85 each. I decided to do the Aviation first (never seen this brand before, anyone have any information?) as I liked the look of it and it was made in England, you rarely see that these days so I wanted to restore some national pride! Also, I wanted to break my curse of the cushion type watches!

Here is the front view when it arrived:

And here is the back view:

Here is the movement dial side:

And the other side  :

And finally the finished watch:

My timegrapher freaked out when trying to adjust the time, I think this has something to do with it being a pin pallet (?) so adjusted manually by trial and error and have it down to just a few seconds a day so happy with that  . It is also missing a seconds hand, but decided to leave it out as the watch looks OK on the wrist without it, but I can add one later if I feel the need.

Edited April 14, 2023 by Waggy
Fixed typo

[AndyHull]

I'm fairly sure that "Aviation" was a brand name of Newmark. If so, they were made by Louis Newmark Ltd., Perfect Works, Stafford Road, Croydon Surrey.

There seems to have been some tie up between them and the Services Watch Co., Ltd.

It certainly looks like one of their simple pin lever mechanisms.

Some more info here -> https://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Louis_Newmark

I'm not sure if Services/Newmark manufactured the mechanisms in house, or imported them incomplete from Switzerland, and built the watches from a mix of in house components (cases etc).

Newmark also distributed Avia, which of course used Swiss movements.

Edited April 14, 2023 by AndyHull

[Neverenoughwatches]

42 minutes ago, AndyHull said:

There seems to have been some tie up between them and the Services Watch Co., Ltd.

I also made this connection Andy. Have also seen identical movements side by side of Smiths, Ingersoll, Services and Newmark. Maybe all by supplied by Smiths.  Smiths and Ingersoll if i remember had a temporary join of two companies.

[AndyHull]

@Waggy I thought I had a Newmark in the collection, so I tool a look and sure enough, not only is it a Newmark, but it is also an Aviation.

I even posted about it back in 2019

These are pretty thick watches, and I must admit it does tick pretty loudly, but lets call that "wrist presence" and assume it is a good thing.
Its certainly not as big or obtrusive as one of these newfangled "smart" watch gadgets.

Your post finally stirred me into action and I replaced the crystal on mine today. I must say it has made a huge difference to its appearance. 

The period correct strap also got a bit of TLC, and I gave it another polish for good measure.

Bizarrely it appears to run at 17280 bph, which makes it a bit of an odd ball to say the least. Assuming this is correct, (and five minutes of "research" on Google suggests that it is correct) that may be why your time grapher was not sure what to make of it.

Some more info about Newmark can be found here -> https://chronopedia.club/Newmark

Edited April 14, 2023 by AndyHull

[Waggy]

Another 404 watch brought back to life, this one is an Ingersol REX and was included in a batch of 20 others, making the average value £2.85:

When it arrived it looked like this:

And here it is when I finished:

All in all the build went well and is 100% original, even the crystal (apart from the strap of course) and I'm very pleased with the results  

I'm not familiar with an Ingersol REX, I have some regular Ingersols, but never seen a REX version, so if anyone can shed some light on this it would be appreciated.

 

Edited May 4, 2023 by Waggy

[KarlvonKoln]

What did you use to clean the dial?  It looks great!  Well, the whole thing looks great.  Nice!

[Waggy]

Just now, KarlvonKoln said:

What did you use to clean the dial?

OK people are going to throw rocks at me now....... but the dial was an etched metal with no lacquer etc, so I used water on a cotton bud, carefully rolling it and it cleaned it a little without any damage and I noticed that the numbers were surviving, then I used some IPA, and again everything survived..... then I used some silver polish paste in one corner and and it came up great with no damage, so I thought "what the heck" and did the whole dial in silver polish and this is how it turned out. I decided to stop there and not get the belt sander out. I took it in small steps and would definitely not recommend hitting a modern dial with anything other than water, but I got away with it in this old dial... this time.

[spectre6000]

4 hours ago, Waggy said:

I decided to stop there and not get the belt sander out. 

LOL! Definitely got a little lucky. The freedom to experiment with things like that is part of what makes 404s so great!