Jump to content

needle files


Willow

Recommended Posts

Hi Willow  as long as you have 5 sided cutting broaches and smoothing broaches you will be ok you will some time need to trim a bush using a bulls foot file (look it up).  I have a full selection of needle files used for a variety of jobs, they are always usefull.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you have a lathe you do not need a bulls foot file. Needle of various shapes and cuts  as well as slotting files are always handy to have. I always preferred to turn the bush down to the right size and height without using files, bulls foot file will mark the plate you are bushing. I always made my own bushes.   Sinkers are good to have as well.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The only time i need a needle file is when the pivot hole is extremely worn. 

Say one side of the pivot hole is elongated away from its original center.  I use the round needle file to open up the pivot hole on the unworn side opposite to the elongation.  Thus when i go to center the bushing machine its a bit easier to ream out.

Usually the pivot hole wont need the filing.  This is extreme instances where the hole is so whacked that attempting to ream may shift the plate or break the reamer.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't necessarily agree that a broach will find the center of a worn hole. With some reamers the tool may well center in the oil sink, which in most cases is concentric with the original pivot hole, but a broach will tend to average over the original center and new center. In the image the outer circle is the oil sink, the black portion is the original hole and the cross the original center. The light blue portion is the worn area, the red circle its center and the magenta circle is the "average center". If we just broach the hole open the broach will tend toward the average center, or perhaps a bit more toward the original hole as it's larger, but will still be off. That the clock ran until its current state of wear, it will almost certainly run and run better than before even with the new "average" center, but it could be better. The upside is if a bushing is put in, even in the semi-wrong location, future wear will be in the bushing, which will be replaced and be in the same location (i.e. you won't be stacking up wear errors).

 

Personally I tend to give a few licks with a file or drift broach to get the hole reasonably centered, but in some cases especially if the wheel or pinion isn't right next to the plate I trust that the oil sink will center my tool.

 

 

pivot hole wear.jpg

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

With a five sided reamer it will work from the original hole and miss the elongated part at first only when it is cutting will it cut the outer which will be the worn part. If you use the right size tool and insert it in the hole you can see it isn't touching the elongated part. 

Looks like we will have to agree to disagree. :DStay safe my friend.  

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, nickelsilver said:

Personally I tend to give a few licks with a file or drift broach to get the hole reasonably centered, but in some cases especially if the wheel or pinion isn't right next to the plate I trust that the oil sink will center my tool.

I can, 9 times out of 10, use the bergeon bushing tool dead center bit to center the hole to be reamed out.  Once the plate is secured in the clamps, the dead center will have a slight gap on the side where the pivot hole is worn.  Then i find the smallest reamer that will fit the hole and i use that to cut only the side that is unworn FIRST by turning the reamer 180 degrees only.  After im confident ive enlarged the hole on the one side i go for a larger reamer that will fit the hole and turn that one 360 degrees until its completely sunk up to the shank of the reamer. Then ream to bushing size.

If the pivot hole is terribly out of shape i file the unworn side first because the reamer has a tendency to snag the edge of the worn part of the pivot hole.

I cant see how a 5 sided reamer will find the original center because to use that type reamer youre working with your hand instead of both plate and reamer being stationary/clamped like the bergeon bushing machine allows.

So i agree with you @nickelsilver

 

pivot hole wear.jpg

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As I recall OH didn't use a bushing tool (I don't either), and I'm sure he got terrific results from his technique. I can see what you're saying OH about the broach tending to center up in the original hole but will agree to disagree about how well in all cases- but it's not a criticism, more of an observation and a feeling. I come from a background in prototyping of watches and do fall into the trap of being a little too finicky with clocks- haha.

 

One thing we very much agree  on is making bushings as needed and to size- I hate seeing bushings standing 1.5mm out of the plate, especially as sometimes the pivot doesn't even reach the oil sink which has its own set of problems.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.



  • Recently Browsing

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Topics

  • Posts

    • Hi guys I think that old hippy is correct, it opens the gates for china to manufacture aftermarket spare parts. considering that they already do work on behalf of the Swiss I guess this decision gives the a little more legitimacy to tool up and I am sure they will take advantage of the situation either with or without the blessing of the Swiss watch industry  Having read about the protectionist machinations of the Swiss in the history of Europe they were the only ones to get fat at everybody else’s expense. I think the outcome could have been guessed at but ,  fair play to Cousins UK for standing up to them.  Now the question,  will everybody boycott Swiss watches and Swatch, no way they will still fill their coffers.  Me I stick with the Japanese once renowned for cheap shitty watches who came good through industrial effort and don’t for get the Russians that most dismiss as low grade crap. Wouldn’t buy a swatch product ever how about you all.? a
    • Hold the crown when in winding position, move the click away from the crown wheel, and then while holding the crown let it slowly unwind. I recollect that you must remove the automatic device bridge first, but maybe I'm wrong. You can first try without removing the automatic device bridge.
    • nevenbekriev- You nailed it with your description of me and my reaction when the clock started ticking again. I am a newbie.  I love the sound and idea of mechanical clocks but the idea of owning one and trying to keep them running has never appealed to me. My wife bought this one and an antique German wall clock.  When I looked into having someone repair them for me, the universal response was "it's really expensive to work on them, you should just replace the movement". So, I had nothing to lose, I started researching them and opened them up. The wife is happy because she hears the sound of the clocks again. But I have gone down the "accuracy" rabbit hole. In the vertical position, the balance wheel was not floating. It was sitting on the bottom of the frame. I adjusted the lower spring collet and got it floating. It easily passed the 270 degree 3 to 5 minute oscillation test. It took 8 minutes for the wheel to completely stop moving.  I put it the unit back in the movement and checked the safety pin. It does not touch the safety roller anywhere in +/-270 degrees rotation from neutral position. But the amplitude of the rotation with the spring fully wound is weak based on what you are saying. It rotates +/-90 degrees from the neutral position.  No, I did not take the movement completely apart.  That seemed way outside my skill set at the time. There is a reason I became an electrical engineer and not a mechanical engineer. I am much more comfortable with moving electrons than tiny moving metal parts. Will I do it in the long run? Anything can happen. I don't seem to be able to let it go.
    • Isn't that the same guy who told Zelenskyy to escalate the war with Russia/Putin when they already had a peace deal? 2 years later and we have half a million young Ukranian boys dead. He doesn't seem very clever...
×
×
  • Create New...