Epic Fail - Help Resetting Lower Balance Shock Rolex 3135

[mzinski]

On 2/7/2020 at 6:03 AM, m1ks said:

Yup, you've got a squiffy pivot there.

If you pull the wheel out and roll the pivot on some sheet glass or a flat staking block you'll be able to see it. Theoretically you should be able to even it if you carefully roll it and apply pressure from the top with something like a smoothing file, or any hardened flat smooth steel.

Mark did a video on re pivotting where at the start he shows the technique mentioned. The key is to go carefully as pivots can and will break easily.

Thanks - very helpful but it’s not working out for me. I’m going to just order a new part. 
So the other frustration - the balance wheel is moving weakly, amplitude is down, and lots of beat error. After much fiddling I’ve noticed the jewel setting bloc is much looser and susceptible to moving than I originally thought. 
I am buying a new bloc as well. 
My new concerns: 

- could the brass shock bloc have damaged the hole in the main plate when it slipped thru? I would think not, brass is softer - but we’re talking small parts here. 
- Which direction do I install the new shock bloc from? Ideally I can push in from the non-dial side (the side where the balance wheel is). This would allow the easiest setting with the jeweling tool. 
 

Thanks again for helping me thru this. 

[m1ks]

The main thing is that you're getting there and the parts can be replaced.

While I can't speak for the construction of Rolex plates and shock settings, all others I've worked on have the shock housings pressed in from the top side. So dial side towards the pivot and bridge side towards the pivot. They're typically slightly shouldered. If this one isn't then it may press in from the pivot side but I'd personally go from dial side.

Hope the replacement parts work out for you. I'm a little curious as to why this one came loose though. A thought, but it is edging into 'bodge' territory. If the fit is tight enough a little loctite thread locking compound on the outer edges of the housing should secure it to save having to replace it?

Hopefully of course the new replacement should press in and be secure.

[Nucejoe]

Generally to tighten the fit, you can guage or make grooves on the outer surface of the housing, I have had 100% success with it, but its been on not so pricy piece.

I usually use sharp edge of a screwdriver blade to the make grooves. I Leave the plate undisturbed.

Good luck.

 

[JohnR725]

14 hours ago, Nucejoe said:

Generally to tighten the fit, you can guage or make grooves on the outer surface of the housing, I have had 100% success with it, but its been on not so pricy piece.

If it fixes the problem 100% why should it matter if the watch is really expensive?

I'm wondering if you have a defective watch and maybe you should send it back to Rolex for warranty repair? Because the lower assembly shouldn't fall out and it should go back in and stay in place.

Then they do make tools for closing holes in a more uniform fashion then recommended above I'm attaching an image. But you want to be careful here and not to get carried away and smash the heck out of the hole otherwise you're going to need a new plate.

16 hours ago, m1ks said:

While I can't speak for the construction of Rolex plates and shock settings, all others I've worked on have the shock housings pressed in from the top side. So dial side towards the pivot and bridge side towards the pivot. They're typically slightly shouldered. If this one isn't then it may press in from the pivot side but I'd personally go from dial side.

It's probably a dyslexia thing on my part but I think I'm reading this backwards from the way I usually think about it? I'm attaching an image out of the Seitz manual showing a jewel but the same principle applies. Looking at my Kif book unfortunately it's not a PDF it shows the settings being pushed in the same as the jewel is being pushed..

Then from the Rolex Service manual side view of the balance assembly. It is not a lot of thickness to the plate the setting needs to be centered for maximum strength. The adjustment of end shake is by the brass nuts on the other side. The alignment of the balance wheel with the pallet fork in all of this is extremely close tolerances. Rolex gets really obsessed with end shake adjustments so there's not a lot of play here.

 

 

[jdm]

12 hours ago, JohnR725 said:

I'm wondering if you have a defective watch and maybe you should send it back to Rolex for warranty repair? Because the lower assembly shouldn't fall out and it should go back in and stay in place.

Just to stay on the realistic side of things, it would impossible to send the OP watch for "warranty repair".
Even before considering when/where it was purchased, the simple fact that has been taken apart would make warranty decade under any jurisdiction.

[JohnR725]

5 minutes ago, jdm said:

Just to stay on the realistic side of things, it would impossible to send the OP watch for "warranty repair".
Even before considering when/where it was purchased, the simple fact that has been taken apart would make warranty decade under any jurisdiction.

Yes technically a right you can't send it in especially after I had a conversation with somebody who understands servicing Rolex watches. If you look at the image I attached up above it shows the two little nuts for adjusting the balance end shake. Then if you read the original posting after servicing everything bad happened that's because the regulating nut's as Rolex calls them relocated tight giving zero adjustments which is why the lower jewel assembly had its issues. So obviously it's not a warranty issue or a manufacturing defect. It's what happens if you don't have a service manual to understand what those little nuts were for.

[mzinski]

6 hours ago, JohnR725 said:

Yes technically a right you can't send it in especially after I had a conversation with somebody who understands servicing Rolex watches. If you look at the image I attached up above it shows the two little nuts for adjusting the balance end shake. Then if you read the original posting after servicing everything bad happened that's because the regulating nut's as Rolex calls them relocated tight giving zero adjustments which is why the lower jewel assembly had its issues. So obviously it's not a warranty issue or a manufacturing defect. It's what happens if you don't have a service manual to understand what those little nuts were for.

Huh - Interesting theory. It’s a late 80’s watch. Case back bears no markings or service. Main spring was caked with dry grease. Rest of the movement, dry as a bone. 
In my disassembly, cleaning, and reassembly, I did not adjust the end shake nuts. 

[mzinski]

19 hours ago, JohnR725 said:

If it fixes the problem 100% why should it matter if the watch is really expensive?

I'm wondering if you have a defective watch and maybe you should send it back to Rolex for warranty repair? Because the lower assembly shouldn't fall out and it should go back in and stay in place.

Then they do make tools for closing holes in a more uniform fashion then recommended above I'm attaching an image. But you want to be careful here and not to get carried away and smash the heck out of the hole otherwise you're going to need a new plate.

It's probably a dyslexia thing on my part but I think I'm reading this backwards from the way I usually think about it? I'm attaching an image out of the Seitz manual showing a jewel but the same principle applies. Looking at my Kif book unfortunately it's not a PDF it shows the settings being pushed in the same as the jewel is being pushed..

Then from the Rolex Service manual side view of the balance assembly. It is not a lot of thickness to the plate the setting needs to be centered for maximum strength. The adjustment of end shake is by the brass nuts on the other side. The alignment of the balance wheel with the pallet fork in all of this is extremely close tolerances. Rolex gets really obsessed with end shake adjustments so there's not a lot of play here.

 

 

Okay, just to reconfirm while I wait for parts to arrive: it will be okay to press in the shock bloc from the bottom side (balance side) of the movement. 

I want to go this direction for a few reasons: 

1. The main plate has a step in it almost directly adjacent to the hole for the shock bloc. It quite infeasible to get a level, surface for the press if I’m trying to use a “donut” (forgive my lack of technical term) chuck on that side. 
2. The end result is not level or flush with anything. It is much easier to press in to the correct height on the protruding side, IMO, because of item 1. above. 
3. The shock bloc has the most surface area on the balance side. Again, personal opinion but it seems helpful to press on this surface. 
 

Anyways, please set me straight if I’m off in my thinking. Thanks again!! 

[JohnR725]

1 hour ago, mzinski said:

I did not adjust the end shake nuts

The most likely scenario for lack of end shake is that the nuts rotated. So once the balance bridge is removed apparently they are free to rotate like in a cleaning machine for instance.

Then yes the direction your indicating is the proper direction. Which is also probably why they have a flat area for you to do your pushing. Knowing Rolex they probably have special pushers just for this.

 

[mzinski]

Well the story had a happy ending - for those of you who’ve been on the edge of your seat, holding your breath in anticipation of a conclusion. 
The parts were installed without issue. I finished up the service of the movement. Regulated, tested, and re-cases it. It’s wearing well and I can breath a little sigh of relief. 
Actually, this has put me on to want to work on more movements like this. Time to find me some broken Rolex watches! (Do those evening exist anywhere????) 

Thanks again to everyone for your help!!! Don’t know where I’d be without a forum like this. No, wait, on second thought I do, up s**** creek! 

 

Edited March 1, 2020 by mzinski