Any Hints on Repairing this Watch

[jdrichard]

I’m diving into a Tudor Auto Prince watch and I need any hints possible; like how to remove the rotor for example. Usually I can figure all this out, but why not ask.

 

 

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[Chopin]

You have to remove the entire automatic ensemble (the weight + the plate/bridge underneath it). Usually 2-3 screws.

Then you turn around the ensemble and I imagine you'll figure out how it all comes apart. 

Edited January 19, 2020 by Chopin

[jdrichard]

ETA 2484 Movement


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[jdrichard]

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[Chopin]

As I said, you have to remove the rotor along with the bridge underneath it (the one that holds a few other tiny gears as well).

The screw that holds the rotor itself is on the other side btw. You can also turn halfway that screw that is cut to remove the 2 small gears.

Also do that once you remove the ensemble. It'll be easier.

[jdrichard]

You have to remove the entire automatic ensemble (the weight + the plate/bridge underneath it). Usually 2-3 screws.
Then you turn around the ensemble and I imagine you'll figure out how it all comes apart. [emoji4]

Thanks for the tip. There are no screws for the rotor so I was curious how the auto winding mechanism comes off.


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[jdrichard]

As I said, you have to remove the rotor along with the bridge underneath it (the one that holds a few other tiny gears as well).
The screw that holds the rotor itself is on the other side btw. You can also turn halfway that screw that is cut to remove the 2 small gears.
Also do that once you remove the ensemble. It'll be easier.

Ok, got it, thanks.


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[Nucejoe]

Release barrel power before you remove the wider module.

Normally the two module screws come in gunmetal dark colour.

 I think( not sure)  there was a caliber of this design that had a real tiny polymer spacer/washer on the rotor screw, which easily goes un-noticed, make sure not to loose it, the rotor would feel loose without it. These rotors work forever with no slack.

Reversers are to be cleaned best, lubed and use epilame fixodrop to seal the oil in. Replace reversers with new ones in case of slightest fault. 

Regards

 

 

 

 

 

[jdrichard]

Release barrel power before you remove the wider module.
Normally the two module screws come in gunmetal dark colour.
 I think( not sure)  there was a caliber of this design that had a real tiny polymer spacer/washer on the rotor screw, which easily goes un-noticed, make sure not to loose it, the rotor would feel loose without it. These rotors work forever with no slack.
Reversers are to be cleaned best, lubed and use epilame fixodrop to seal the oil in. Replace reversers with new ones in case of slightest fault. 
Regards
 
 
 
 
 

Very good hints. Thanks NJoe. You have obviously worked on these. I will not be drinking coffee when I start on this one.


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[nickelsilver]

Pretty sure you can't release the power before removing the auto module. Don't worry, it's ok to take it off. The click for the ratchet wheel will take over once the module is removed.

 

This is derived from an ETA 2472 (or that family), VWatchie did a walkthrough that should be helpful.

https://www.watchrepairtalk.com/topic/12634-eta-calibre-2472-service-walkthrough/

Edited January 20, 2020 by nickelsilver

[jdrichard]

Pretty sure you can't release the power before removing the auto module. Don't worry, it's ok to take it off. The click for the ratchet wheel will take over once the module is removed.
 
This is derived from an ETA 2472 (or that family), VWatchie did a walkthrough that should be helpful.
https://www.watchrepairtalk.com/topic/12634-eta-calibre-2472-service-walkthrough/

I will watch this prior to diving in. Again big thanks


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[jdrichard]

Just went through the walk through and it is very detailed. Thanks. I am going to take pictures as well.


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[Nucejoe]

0I think the movement in your watch is a Chrono grade , I have worked on lower grades of this family, hopefully wide range of interchangible parts, however, you want to rebuilt your balance complete to Chrono standards so to speak.

Very true the click for crown wheel dose take over which prevents power discharge, nevertheless ratchet wheel pushes to turn ratchet wheel,s reduction wheel in the module, the small pinion type gear of which is made of base metal and can get damaged easy. The module design provides access to click screw, I loosened the click screw just enough to raise the click enough to disengage (click-crown wheel), the click can be removed altogether as well.

 

 

 

 

[jdm]

Duplicate of 

OP, please do not post duplicate topics.

[jdrichard]

Duplicate of 
OP, please do not post duplicate topics.

Apologies. I didn’t notice as I had a gap in time and just started on the watch.


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[martygene]

On 1/21/2020 at 2:43 AM, Nucejoe said:

0I think the movement in your watch is a Chrono grade

What tells you that this is chrono grade. Thanks, gene

[martygene]

On 1/20/2020 at 4:54 AM, Nucejoe said:

Reversers are to be cleaned best, lubed and use epilame fixodrop to seal the oil in. Replace reversers with new ones in case of slightest fault. 

I'm not familiar with this product or this practice. Can you tell me more about the epilame? Thanks, gene

[Nucejoe]

Fixodrop is a recommended grease for reversers. Refer to Moebius oil site.

At high reverser speed  oil gets thrown out of its bearings. This grease seals the oil in place, thereby keeps the selfwinder device efficient. 

It is also recommended for pallet jewel- escape teeth interface. Stays put. 

Many discussions to be found on the subject, through the search function.

Regards 

 

[nickelsilver]

As far as I know only Rolex specifies using Fixodrop (epilame) on their reversers, this is because they very much need oil at specific locations and absolutely cannot have oil at others, or they won't work. The epilame keeps the oil from creeping to the wrong place. Typical reversers are oiled in a bath of solvent with a little oil added (old school technique, example would be a couple of drops of 9020 in 10ml of benzine), or with Moebius Lubeta v105 (current practice).

[Nucejoe]

10 hours ago, martygene said:

What tells you that this is chrono grade. Thanks, gene

I heard it and expect a high grade movement from the luxury brand. Usually decorations indicate some higher grade. Starting a thread on the subject brings bunch of info.

[Nucejoe]

10 hours ago, nickelsilver said:

As far as I know only Rolex specifies using Fixodrop (epilame) on their reversers, this is because they very much need oil at specific locations and absolutely cannot have oil at others, or they won't work. The epilame keeps the oil from creeping to the wrong place. Typical reversers are oiled in a bath of solvent with a little oil added (old school technique, example would be a couple of drops of 9020 in 10ml of benzine), or with Moebius Lubeta v105 (current practice).

So am I correct to gather that Tudor lubes by ETA specifications or dose go by Rolex standards?   TIA.

[Nucejoe]

Rogart63 reported lubeta having disappeared from the bottle he had, dispite the lid tightly.preesed on. Was it through  EVAPORATION?

Dose lubeta v106 .evaporate?   I guess v105 dose not.

 

[Marc]

10 minutes ago, Nucejoe said:

Dose lubeta v106 .evaporate?   I guess v105 dose not.

I believe that both evaporate very quickly.

As far as I understand it (I don't use either), they are both either dry lubricants in a highly volatile carrier, or the lubricant portion of it is extremely small so it has to be applied using a carrier to bulk it out for handling purposes. Either way the carrier solvent is designed to be very volatile so that it quickly dries after application, leaving just a very light coating of the actual lubricant behind.

Pretty much the same as the old school "couple of drops of 9020 in 10ml of benzine" trick that @nickelsilver alluded to above; the benzine evaporates leaving behind just the lightest application of 9020 residue.

 

[nickelsilver]

So am I correct to gather that Tudor lubes by ETA specifications or dose go by Rolex standards?   TIA.

The Tudor with the ETA base would use ETA or "normal"; Rolex reversers are fairly unique in design.

[Nucejoe]

2 hours ago, Marc said:

I believe that both evaporate very quickly.

As far as I understand it (I don't use either), they are both either dry lubricants in a highly volatile carrier, or the lubricant portion of it is extremely small so it has to be applied using a carrier to bulk it out for handling purposes. Either way the carrier solvent is designed to be very volatile so that it quickly dries after application, leaving just a very light coating of the actual lubricant behind.

Pretty much the same as the old school "couple of drops of 9020 in 10ml of benzine" trick that @nickelsilver alluded to above; the benzine evaporates leaving behind just the lightest application of 9020 residue.

 

Thanks for explaining Marc.   I always wondered howcome some vintage reversers are gummed up with dried oil,  " little or no carrier solvent". 

Thanks and best wishes.