Waltham Mass Balance Spring

[Nucejoe]

350 sec fast or slow?

If it ran fast, HS would not vibrate with the wheel as is. Screw balance wheel lets you alter mass distribution of the wheel, through addition or subtraction of weight/ washers and you get a chance to practice poising.

In case it ran 350 seconds slow, considering adjustment arm was idle, there is a good  chance it vibrates which means even if someone did fit the wheel with flat hairspring, the wheel and hs are likely to be compatible and vibrate to the beat.

If you can poise and do a nice overcoil, or like to give it a try, you are on.

Good luck.

[carlos123]

I probably will give it a go reshaping it as I’ve nothing to lose, I’ve also found in my stash of bits a similar HS which looks the correct type and same sort of size albeit on a balance with a shorter pivot - although need to measure the width of the pivot. It would be good to use a good example or use if correct.


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[praezis]

Looking at above pictures, I am quite sure, this is the original hairspring that once was a Breguet one. You can see where the up bend is/was. However someone (carlos??) bent the overcoil and formed a "flat"  hairspring. 

Reshaping is nothing for beginners!

Frank

[carlos123]

Looking at above pictures, I am quite sure, this is the original hairspring that once was a Breguet one. You can see where the up bend is/was. However someone (carlos??) bent the overcoil and formed a "flat"  hairspring. 
Reshaping is nothing for beginners!
Frank

It may have bent during the cleaning process hence why it no longer works now, however it’s never worked properly, so who knows...


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[Nucejoe]

11 hours ago, carlos123 said:

I probably will give it a go reshaping it as I’ve nothing to lose, I’ve also found in my stash of bits a similar HS which looks the correct type and same sort of size albeit on a balance with a shorter pivot - although need to measure the width of the pivot. It would be good to use a good example or use if correct.


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Wheels produced back then ( prior to standardization)  didn,t uniformly weigh the same so each needs vibrated with a HS, Which expectedly be the cass if you go with new hairspring, 

Your attitude to go for it is good, watching video lesson on the subject helps a lot, no one was born overcoil expert and it really isn,t rocket science. A member of forum made use of my advice, built an overcoil and reported good result on the first go, saying it worked like a treat.  

Is there a video by Mark on this?  

These hairsprings are kinda rare.  Obsolete useless hairsprings are right choice for pracrice.

 

[praezis]

5 hours ago, Nucejoe said:

Your attitude to go for it is good, watching video lesson on the subject helps a lot, no one was born overcoil expert and it really isn,t rocket science

If something is near to rocket science then making of a correct Breguet coil.

Encouraging a beginner to it is like advice to ruin the rest (we saw this just recently). How can you determine the coil number and the right shape (depending from that number) by watching a video? Not mentioned the special and rare tools that are needed for the work and were discussed here recently.

Frank

[Nucejoe]

22 hours ago, Nucejoe said:

Yes, if the flat HS vibrates the wheel to the right beat, it also will as overcoil. I recommend  reshaping to overcoil. 

1- Moung the stud on stud holder.

2- instal balance ( hairspring attached) on the cock.

3- As if you are sculpturing , follow the curve of an overcoil from a picture as your modle. To come up with a fit within the space available above the balance wheel.

I hope I am making sense. 

Easier done than said. 

If the flat HS hairspring vibrates the wheel to the right beat, it will also as overcoil.

 

[carlos123]

I finally managed to get the spring looking almost correct, however it appears the jewel is worn as it’s not yet free starting [emoji2955]


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[Nucejoe]

On 9/29/2019 at 1:07 PM, praezis said:

If something is near to rocket science then making of a correct Breguet coil.

Encouraging a beginner to it is like advice to ruin the rest (we saw this just recently). How can you determine the coil number and the right shape (depending from that number) by watching a video? Not mentioned the special and rare tools that are needed for the work and were discussed here recently.

Frank

 

4 hours ago, carlos123 said:

I finally managed to get the spring looking almost correct, however it appears the jewel is worn as it’s not yet free starting


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You have done even better shaping the next overcoil (s). Lessons won,t be just another lecture, but answer your questions.   Congrat .

 

[praezis]

Not a real Breguet coil and a good bit out of center, but I'd say: not bad for the 1st time!

Frank

[carlos123]

Not a real Breguet coil and a good bit out of center, but I'd say: not bad for the 1st time!
Frank

Thanks Frank!

I shall have another go to centralise the coil when I have a go at changing the jewel/stone. I’ve got a few spare pocket watch parts which I’m hoping to have a replacement part, if not will have to buy one from somewhere...



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[Nucejoe]

End curve on bereguet and flat hairsprings are to do the same,  both should let the spring slide through the slot, as you move the regulator arm throughout its span.

The spring is bent at the end of the curve.

Best

 

[Nucejoe]

On 9/29/2019 at 1:07 PM, praezis said:

If something is near to rocket science then making of a correct Breguet coil.

Encouraging a beginner to it is like advice to ruin the rest (we saw this just recently). How can you determine the coil number and the right shape (depending from that number) by watching a video? Not mentioned the special and rare tools that are needed for the work and were discussed here recently.

Frank

     ?

[nickelsilver]

47 minutes ago, Nucejoe said:

     ?

The actual form of the overcoil is a very highly studied subject and has a very real effect on the performance of the watch. If someone isn't used to the comparatively easy tasks of leveling and centering a flat spring, then reforming an overcoil to some sort of usable shape and getting it centered and flat is a tall order. I think that's what Frank is saying. It looks like the OP is doing well though, it could have gone waay worse!