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Koen

My first maintenance / repair of a pocketwatch.

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So guys,

My bench is delivered this week so I wanted to start right away.

IMG_8954.thumb.jpeg.604318cc120e26653458d38d33164ab2.jpeg

 

My father gave me 5 pocket watches that don't work, so I take one that looks compleet to me.

 

Take it apart, making photo's of it while I am doing the remove of te parts.

Dam... Have I lost the pallet fork? Don't see it? After some search on the net and talk with somebody from Holland I know it's a cylindric balance. So no pallet fork. :D

IMG_8976.thumb.jpeg.d91f0c14776e0c2e4ec73f487f42e9cf.jpeg

Clean the parts in jars with the US.

After this putting them back together. Broke already my first screw driver on the screw that is turning "wrong way" lucky I have some extra bits. ( I am a rookie so that's ok ;-) )

 

IMG_8985.thumb.jpeg.89e603034072e73cae4a629e20c8a844.jpeg

 

Ready... NOT... it seems that the the balance wheel is touching a bridge.

 

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Talk again with the Dutch guy on a forum, and with some pictures he notice that I forgot the jewel on the bottom. Ooo I have the plate/jewel stil under the dustcover. ;-) and the screw was still in one of the jars, so tiny it is. ( Yes I am used to work with bolts, but they are M8 and M10 :biggrin: )

Fixing this, it seems that it's ok, winding the watch, but it won't start... I give the balance wheel a push and wow it works and don't wan't to stop again. NICE for my first attempt of cleaning a pocket watch.:woohoo-jumping-smiley-emoticon:

Must say I am afraid of wrist watches now, because with pocket watch screws, you still can put them between your fingers to put it in the tweezer.:rolleyes:

 

So for fun I put it in the Timegrapher, don't know the lift angle or if the Witschi wil recognize a cylindric escapement. But it's just for fun. 

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Think I have to go on the roof of the house to adjust the TV antenna.:blink:

There is probably something wrong with the balancespring or... ??? WTF

 

So now 2 questions please to the specialist...

 

Is the little hook to adjust the balance spring in it's place? Do it need to touch the spring or do the spring have to hang inside the hook? I guess the 2e option?

 

IMG_8973.thumb.jpeg.f9da2e8c0666ac0821d6a142e915d71a.jpeg

 

IMG_8984.thumb.jpeg.c81dc7db6d0b52f5cba2c7b31f20a53c.jpeg

 

And my 2e question, one of the hands is broken, so how to measure the hole so I can order new ones? ( Don't have the Bergeon tool yet to measure the holes. )

 

Thanks guys for viewing and your comments.

 

For My first time I am already happy.

Edited by Koen

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The movement is known as a 5 bar movement, with cylinder escapement. One of the regulator pins I see is missing; someone has turned the one remaining pin into a bit of a hook. If you look at the top of the regulator, a hole is for the other pin. Timing machines in my days back in the 70’s and 80’s didn’t pick up cylinder movements very well. I don’t know about the modern ones of today. I will just say your machines readings are all over the place because of the movement not being regulated because of the missing pin. Cylinder escapements are not compensated so can and do very with the weather; a couple of minute’s ether way is satisfactory. The hand measure from the centre to around the minute markers that is about the length. If you have means to measure the pivot for the hand that will give you the size, you can reamer out the hole to get it to fit, be careful the metal is tough. One of the most common styles of hand for these movements are called spade and they are a very dark blue/black. Some also are of a brass/gold type colour again spade. There are many styles of hands; I have given you the most common.    

Where did you get the very nice work bench? It looks so well made. 

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Like OH I had the old paper tape timing machines back in the day. They would spit out enough dots to get pretty close on most cylinders, but not always. Agree that without the missing pin (probably a Swiss key or "boot" shape) you won't get any sort of result. My WItschi (S1) doesn't pick up cylinders at all and both my old Vibrograf B200 machines are dead, so I check that they are in beat visually, and by ear, then time them just checking the time over 24 hours.

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Thanks @oldhippy for your help... Go see if I can find the hands.

The bench is made by a Dutch guy living in Friesland, http://www.dumetwatches.com

Very happy with the workbench, aluminium frame, hand made tabletop and drawers from Ikea. 

 

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I am happy the watch works again, so for my first time, very happy! ;-)

Edited by Koen

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3 hours ago, oldhippy said:

The movement is known as a 5 bar movement, with cylinder escapement. One of the regulator pins I see is missing; someone has turned the one remaining pin into a bit of a hook. If you look at the top of the regulator, a hole is for the other pin.

Do you have a photo so I can see how it normally must be? So I can fix it.

 

Or is this ok with the hook?

 

Stil have a problem, if the balance wheel stops because no power main spring, it wont start after winding, so there I have a small issue. ;-)

 

Thanks

Edited by Koen

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Well done, and very entertaining. Even though i slightly advanced from beginner, can remember the frustration of pinging parts into oblivion, not so common nowadays, and not photographing stages! Having spares on rebuild :wacko: etc. 

Love to see your next project, keep up the good work.

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Hi Koen,

no need to offer the usual advice of "buy the best tools you can afford" in your case! That is a very nice work area indeed. You are obviously someone who likes to prepare very well before beginning work.

As far as  the timegrapher readings go, I would take them with a big pinch of salt wrt. cylinder escapements. Check the timekeeping after an hour, and if that's OK then after 24 hours.

Also, don't worry about the watch not starting on its own when you wind it up. Cylinder escapements don't self-start like anchor escapements do. You have to give them a good shake with power in  the main-spring.

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I cant find a good clear close up photo of the regulator pins. You have to pins with a small gape one each side of the hairspring. The hairspring must be free in all positions no mater where the regulator is, the hairspring must be able to move between both pins( I like to call it bounce) One of the reasons it might not start on its own, it could be slightly out of beat. A cylinder can be fiddly to get in beat, if you are a beginner, I would leave it be and see how it goes for time.    

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Dank u Nuti......... ;)

 

Beco have nice once's, bud more expansive and this Jan Bench is great value for the money.

Edited by Koen

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So I tested the pocket watch for 24h and it gain +/- 3 minutes.

Adjusting by the compass is not making a difference ... so it's just an old watch. :P

Edited by Koen

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6 hours ago, Koen said:

So I tested the pocket watch for 24h and it gain +/- 3 minutes.

Adjusting by the compass is not making a difference ... so it's just an old watch. :P

   how do you adjust a watch with a compass ?   is that something just for cylindar escapements.   cheers  vin

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1 hour ago, vinn3 said:

   how do you adjust a watch with a compass ?   is that something just for cylindar escapements.   cheers  vin

Maybe I use the wrong words, I speek dutch normally.

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On 9/7/2019 at 5:14 PM, oldhippy said:

I cant find a good clear close up photo of the regulator pins. You have to pins with a small gape one each side of the hairspring. The hairspring must be free in all positions no mater where the regulator is, the hairspring must be able to move between both pins( I like to call it bounce) One of the reasons it might not start on its own, it could be slightly out of beat. A cylinder can be fiddly to get in beat, if you are a beginner, I would leave it be and see how it goes for time.    

Would this do?

RegulatorArm_Pin_Boot_Slot.jpg.031db0f6bc92fb81686219e3f4613ec5.jpg

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Considering it's a cylinder escapement, and has that hook instead of banking pins (which doesn't seem to be doing anything by the way, if moving it has no effect), that's a very acceptable result. Maybe try carrying it in a pocket all day, and see if you get serviceable results in use. Position, temperature, and how fully it is wound are all likely to significantly affect the accuracy. If that works out OK then I would leave well alone and be very pleased with that as a first job.

By "compass" I'm guessing you mean the regulator. It will be worth your while learning about the correct (English) terminology for watch parts if you are going to use this forum effectively.

By the way, what is that microscope on your bench?

 

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Thanks all you guys...

 

You are all very helpful, much appreciation!

I wind it every morning, so its always full winded every 12 hours now.

Bud maybe I have to make 2 new pins for the regulator.

31 minutes ago, Klassiker said:

By the way, what is that microscope on your bench?

This one.

https://www.astromarket.org/stereo-miscroscopen/euromex-stereomicroscoop-sb-1402-stereoblue-2-4/p,44675

 

 

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2 hours ago, Klassiker said:

Considering it's a cylinder escapement, and has that hook instead of banking pins (which doesn't seem to be doing anything by the way, if moving it has no effect), that's a very acceptable result. Maybe try carrying it in a pocket all day, and see if you get serviceable results in use. Position, temperature, and how fully it is wound are all likely to significantly affect the accuracy. If that works out OK then I would leave well alone and be very pleased with that as a first job.

By "compass" I'm guessing you mean the regulator. It will be worth your while learning about the correct (English) terminology for watch parts if you are going to use this forum effectively.

By the way, what is that microscope on your bench?

 

    no problem !    a compass can be used to  determine if the hair spring is magnitized.   welcome to the forum.  vin

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