Jump to content

Question escapement teeth/ pallet fine oil


Recommended Posts

1 minute ago, Nucejoe said:

ETA recommends General purpose moebius 9010 for escape wheel teeth, I am thinking to try a finer oil.

A finer oil would not stay in place due to the centrifugal and highly inertial motion of the escape wheel. I think 9010 was recommended before the introduction of better products in terms of adhesion, 941 and 9415, which in fact is a grease. If you want to try the latter send me a PM with your address. 

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

49 minutes ago, jdm said:

A finer oil would not stay in place due to the centrifugal and highly inertial motion of the escape wheel. I think 9010 was recommended before the introduction of better products in terms of adhesion, 941 and 9415, which in fact is a grease. If you want to try the latter send me a PM with your address. 

Thank you for your response and offer. The name grease is synonymus to stronger drag , which is what I like to reduce. Are there exceptions?  grease with less drag than oil? 

I tested applying kerosene on escapewheel and mixed cheap expired oil with kerosene  for high speed jewel holes, the result is fantastic. Though one expect kerosene unsuitable for the long term and its runny.

Regards

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Inertia is not a factor of significance in finite analysis of escpaewheel and rightfully disregarded. Drag on the other hand is the main factor in fine escape mech design, drag impedes the force the fork is to transfer to the impulse jewel.

Escapewheel force is so strong that co-axial makes use of it in both beats of a cycle, to enhance steady performance of the balance wheel, very useful on wrist.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think you'll find the link below interesting.

As mentioned above it used to be 9010 was recommended on pallet stones even Seiko up until relatively recently was using it. Then 941 came into existence interestingly enough it's slightly lighter in viscosity than 9010. Then much later on 9415 classified as a grease for higher frequency Escapement's. 9415 has interesting properties it's a grease so it stays in place but on the impact it becomes fluid. Then if you look at current tech sheets they probably grasp that watchmakers are cheap and it's basically either or for 941 or 9415.

Then I'm attaching a PDF Starting on page 13 is lubrication of a lever escapement. This is where things get really complicated 9415 has a problem if it is applied too heavy. So they explain how it has to be applied very very thinly. You'll also notice another term Lubrifar which is really just Molybdenum disulfide ETA And probably others have been using it for quite a number of years on the escape wheels.

 

http://www.moebius-lubricants.ch/en/products/oils

8645_WI_40_rules for lubrication.pdf

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

37 minutes ago, Nucejoe said:

Inertia is not a factor of significance in finite analysis of escpaewheel and rightfully disregarded.

it is applicable to the fluid attached to wheel by virtue of its surface tension and viscosity. The sudden stop and restart of the escape wheel makes so that the mass of the lubricant  tries to continue its condition of motion, or lack of it. The less adhesion, the more mass,  the more instantaneous acceleration of the wheel (characteristic of high-beat mov't) , the more the fluid will tend to leave the pallet face. and spread around. Not good.
I would not underestimate the research and science that is behind current watch lubricants. Even if you can get perfectly acceptable results with these of one or two generations ago that doesn't mean that the accessible alternative isn't better.

Edited by jdm
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, nickelsilver said:

9415 is a thixotropic grease. It reduces drastically in viscosity instantly at the shear point when objects it's applied to are in motion, and returns to it's thicker state when at rest. It's good stuff.

Thank you @nickelsilver ,  drastic reduction in viscosity, just what I was hoping to find.

Regards

Link to comment
Share on other sites



  • Recently Browsing

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Topics

  • Posts

    • that band is old as stated, there is a kit that pops up from time to time on selling sites for the repair of these type bands, some of this type are adjustable on a few links, one adjustable type allows you to align the round opening in the expansion slit [like yours] with the rivet to separate, but if yours won't come out then the rivet head is too big and will have to be done with some rivet removal and replacement, I suppose if you could make/optain the correct rivets that one could alter the said band, the tops/caps do lift off after raising the tabs....  
    • This is a watch from a friend who sent it to a neighborhood watchmaker for a battery change. It came back with the watch stem in a ziplock bag and the dial skewed 20°. The watchmaker told him that the stem was faulty and the watch cannot be repaired. I opened up the watch and found that one dial foot was broken off and still stuck in the movement, while the other was bent until it was flat against the dial. The stem could be inserted but it couldn't be pulled out to quickset and time adjusting positions. I did a full disassemble, cleaned and oiled the movement. But when it put in the battery, the second hand runs super fast. Like it gains 30 mins every hour. Any advice on fixing this problem? TIA.
    • I determined that the balance staff is rotating, not the roller table, so my second attempt at riveting was unsuccessful. I have ordered a new balance staff and will take measurements when it arrives. The balance staff i originally ordered (and now reordered) was specified as: Replacement balance staff: (A. Schild Caliber 984 1002 1021 1124 Original Balance Staff Part 723) so it should be correct. Measurements: (see pic below for terminology) xxxyy is a place holder until the new balance staff arrives. Lower pivot: Old - .08 mm New - xxxyy Lower pivot to balance seat: Old - 1.53 mm New - xxxyy Roller shoulder: Old - .42 mm New - xxxyy Hub: Old - xxxyy New - xxxyy Balance shoulder: Old - .86 mm New - xxxyy Collet shoulder: Old - .56 mm New - xxxyy Upper pivot: Old - broken New - xxxyy
    • Hello and welcome from Leeds.  We're here to help. 
    • I was just about to adk that, probably they have unnecessary waiting lists to make their watches appear more exclusive than they actually are.
×
×
  • Create New...