HELP with escapement

[saswatch88]

53 minutes ago, VWatchie said:

Thanks, and very interesting! It seems like a very pragmatic solution and one that I’ve never heard of before. Anyway, and please bear with me as I’m still new to watch repair, do I get it right that you remove the hairspring from the balance wheel, or do you just remove the balance wheel complete with the hairspring?

The reason I’m asking is that I imagine the hairspring (if still attached to the balance), and especially the stud, would be all over the place bumping into the other parts of the watch and perhaps even entangle the hairspring while you “spin it with a puff of air and observe the shakes”.

(As it happens, I just removed my first hairspring from a balance wheel today (prying off the collet with a pair of hand levers while having the balance rest on a staking block). I have a bunch of scrap movements to practice with and on my first attempt I ruined the hairspring and snapped the balance staff. On my second attempt, everything went very smooth. Very proud of myself! )
 

i remove the BW and spring complete, the stud doesnt hit anything except the cock but at this point your just checking end shakes so it does not matter much, you can always just slip the stud back intop the cock and just dont tighten the screw. i hate removing hairpsrings because you will have to reset the spring in beat, and if you loosen the collet too much your screwed unless you have that $200 bergeon collet tightener. congrats on removing spring did you make sure you mark the location of the stud? if not gunna have to reset watch in beat, WRT actually has a video on how to do this the easy way. it involves installing wheel and cock, but then laying the spring on top of the cock.

[saswatch88]

10 hours ago, Deggsie said:

I don’t know if this is feasible or possible, but can the jewel be pressed in a little to compensate for the wear on the pivot, thus restoring the clearance required?


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if you are talking about the roller jewel then NO, this will not help if the safety roller is rubbing against the pallet safety pin and /or main plate.

[Deggsie]

if you are talking about the roller jewel then NO, this will not help if the safety roller is rubbing against the pallet safety pin and /or main plate.

No, I was referring to the pivot jewel. If the pivot is worn in length(and you said replacing the staff isn’t an option) then raising the pivot jewel would possibly correct this issue - thus maintaining the staff in correct relative position again.

 

 

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[Nucejoe]

18 hours ago, VWatchie said:

Thanks, and very interesting! It seems like a very pragmatic solution and one that I’ve never heard of before. Anyway, and please bear with me as I’m still new to watch repair, do I get it right that you remove the hairspring from the balance wheel, or do you just remove the balance wheel complete with the hairspring?

The reason I’m asking is that I imagine the hairspring (if still attached to the balance), and especially the stud, would be all over the place bumping into the other parts of the watch and perhaps even entangle the hairspring while you “spin it with a puff of air and observe the shakes”.

(As it happens, I just removed my first hairspring from a balance wheel today (prying off the collet with a pair of hand levers while having the balance rest on a staking block). I have a bunch of scrap movements to practice with and on my first attempt I ruined the hairspring and snapped the balance staff. On my second attempt, everything went very smooth. Very proud of myself! )
 

You risk damage to HS so best remove it, I have done plenty and have mastered to carry this out with HS on the wheel. I also do true wheels right inside the watch.  Been thinking about sharing this but I am afraid to be giving bad advice.

[VWatchie]

On 3/5/2019 at 11:21 PM, saswatch88 said:

i remove the BW and spring complete, the stud doesnt hit anything except the cock but at this point your just checking end shakes so it does not matter much, you can always just slip the stud back intop the cock and just dont tighten the screw. i hate removing hairpsrings because you will have to reset the spring in beat, and if you loosen the collet too much your screwed unless you have that $200 bergeon collet tightener. congrats on removing spring did you make sure you mark the location of the stud? if not gunna have to reset watch in beat, WRT actually has a video on how to do this the easy way. it involves installing wheel and cock, but then laying the spring on top of the cock.

14

Thanks for the update and good to know it won't be necessary to remove the hairspring from the balance wheel to perform the operation of lifting the balance cock, and thanks for the tip about how to keep the stud in check!

Yes, I did mark the location of the stud, thanks! The only reason I removed the hairspring was to practice it. I had no other reason than wanting to see if I could learn how to remove it as I'm working my way through Mark Lovick's watch repair course level 3 "fault finding" (amazing stuff BTW!). In the course, he also demonstrates in detail how to adjust end-shake on a normal jewel bearing using a jewelling tool and it just blew my mind that there is a tool that can adjust the height position of a jewel with the precision of a hundredth of a millimetre. So, I immediately got a jewelling tool fever only to find out that it would cost me somewhere between £300 and £600 depending on the number of parts and condition. I guess I'll wait until I really need one.

I'd love to see that video you mention. Anyone having the link, or where to look or search for? Thanks!

[VWatchie]

On 3/6/2019 at 4:55 PM, Nucejoe said:

You risk damage to HS so best remove it, I have done plenty and have mastered to carry this out with HS on the wheel. I also do true wheels right inside the watch.  Been thinking about sharing this but I am afraid to be giving bad advice.

I appreciate your advice, thanks! Please share and don't worry about "giving bad advice". People can think and make judgements for themselves, and if not it's hardly your responsibility.

[Nucejoe]

12 minutes ago, VWatchie said:

I appreciate your advice, thanks! Please share and don't worry about "giving bad advice". People can think and make judgements for themselves, and if not it's hardly your responsibility.

Thanks for these words of encouragement, Will ask a moderator and wish to post. I think a learner at basic level lacks the kniwledge for such discernment, I hate to think of having helped someone ruin his watch or worse someome elses. 

Regards 

[saswatch88]

Quote

 it just blew my mind that there is a tool that can adjust the height position of a jewel with the precision of a hundredth of a millimetre. So, I immediately got a jewelling tool fever only to find out that it would cost me somewhere between £300 and £600 depending on the number of parts and condition. I guess I'll wait until I really need one.

I found a complete seitz kit for less than $200 once on ebay was only missing one reamer, just no there are other things you may need esp for replacing jewels. 1: jewel setting tool set for opening and closing the surrounding metal hold a non pressure fitted jewel in place, and a jewel guage which are dam near impossible to find complete, or buy a new one from seitz which big $$$

Quote

I also do true wheels right inside the watch

Nuce i do the same thing and dont think its bad advice, i have seen other watchmakers do it as well, sometimes its even better than using a caliper, do you poise the wheels too? i usually only poise older watch BS's with the weights attached.