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bsoderling last won the day on March 24

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About bsoderling

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  1. Lost in the balance staff jungle...again

    Hi and thanks, The combination of a decent dial and workable movement is hard to find. I tend to put priority on the movement and label the dial wear ”patina”. Sounds nicer and I fool myself every time :-)
  2. Lost in the balance staff jungle...again

    To wrap this up.... There was indeed a jewel with my Seitz tool that seemed to be in the right direction ( 0,9 mm OD & 0,11 hole) so no excuse for not trying. And it turned out well with the balance wheel fitting nicely and spinning forever when tried without the hairspring. The hairspring turned out to be a bit of a nightmare. Appearing nice and flat on the wheel still on my table, it tilted heavily once the stud was pushed in. I spent several hours trying trying to grasp the dynamics of that thing and what influences what. Finally a tiny push a few mm’s from the stud levelled the spring to flat and parallell with the wheel. I suspect there must have been different materials used in hairsprings over the years? This one was really soft as butter and made very little resistance to maintain its shape when applying any kind of ”force”. After cleaning and oiling it now runs reasonably well with a decent amplitude. I attached a photo. With the clean and undamaged dial, I guess it’s an ok piece from the period or...? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  3. Lost in the balance staff jungle...again

    Hi Rodabod and thanks for responding. The base plate jewel is definitely not sound even though I can’t see any major cracks. It’s a bit frayed around the edges and even appears a bit oval to my eyes. But there’s not huge side shake around the new staff pivot and on the general list of priorities I am pushing it down a bit for now. In the future I will look a bit closer on the shape of functional balance staff pivots when servicing a movement to see if I can trace any cross section diameter reduction from wear. If I do, I will take that as evidence towards my ”theory” of what happened to my movement. For now (or maybe later :-) ) I will try to gather enough confidence for a jewel swap in the balance cock, using the Seitz tool I bought on the bay a while ago. The previous owner kindly included a few tubes with jewels that might work. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  4. Lost in the balance staff jungle...again

    Hi again... Coming back to this thread as there’s been some development (and more questionmarks). So I found a balance staff type ”ordinary” i.e. No shock protection at all. Got that riveted into the wheel (getting the hang on that procedure now) and tried the wheel in the movement. And it gets stuck hard... After some real close up work with the loupe I realize that the pivot isn’t even prodruding the jewel hole in the balance cock. It goes in a tiny bit and gets stuck. On the bottom plate there’s no such problem, even though the hole looks a bit worn around the edges. So how could this thing ever have run? I then noted that the cock jewel has some burrs around the edges (see photo) i.e. It has probably been swapped out at some point. So my question is if it can be that the old staff got so worn down (diameter) that the guy who replaced the jewel put in one with a smaller hole that actually better fitted the worn pivot? And then obviously the pivot broke at some point.... I would be happy to hear your response on my ”theory”. Bsoderling Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  5. Lost in the balance staff jungle...again autoupdate setting available on those, I guess :-) Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  6. Lost in the balance staff jungle...again

    Hi, Yeah, Ranfft is the obvious place for info. But the balance staff info there refers to Flume no’s and the Flume website seem to leave me hanging as most other sources that supply to hobbyists as myself refer to Ronda or DCN systems. And as Rogart63 is pointing out, this movement comes in a huge variety and ranfft is just a single example. (No complains about ranfft, it’s a brilliant place but can understandably only cover so much) I can’t help wondering how these issues were handled in the good old pre-internet days? Every watchmaker/repairer must have had a huge bookshelf with printed catalogues that needed frequent updating. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  7. Hi guys, Trying to get an old AS984 to run. Balance staff pivots are gone so I start looking in the usual places (, cousins and a few more). My movement is possibly an early version i.e. no inca or other shock protection. What I end up with are way too many staff versions with slightly differing dimensions. Some are indicated as inca but several have no such indication and are still coming in different overall lengths and diameter at the place where the wheel is sitting. I sit here with a list of Ronda no’s that differs ever so slightly in what I guess are the more relevant dimensions and all are somehow related to AS 984. Once I remove the balance wheel I will be able to measure the diameter at the wheel position which may narrow down things a bit, but still frustrating. Curious how the more experienced would go about this problem as trial and error doesn’t seem like a viable option.... /bsoderling Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  8. Hi all, I saw this discussion over K&D staff removal tool versions and wanted to add a few words from my experience. About a year ago I bought myself a rusty old staking set that I managed to get in decent shape. Just to find that I was missing the staff removal tool... So I went ahead and bought one from Uncle Larry, just to find that it is of the shorter kind that leaves a lot of air in the staking tool. But... and I’m not really sure if this is intended or just a bit of fluke but using a stump with a suitable hole size on the staking plate will raise the position for the balance wheel enough to make it all work out fine. On the operation of the tool, my assumption is that the clamping of the balance wheel very close to the staff is what makes this work. This clamping will effectively ”focus” all the force when tapping to the weakest point i.e. the rivet and break this without any damage to the wheel. Things can go wrong of course but it has worked fine several times for me now which can’t be considered too bad for a beginner and should encourage others to try (on something less valuable) Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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  10. Crystal replacement

    Yes, I think so... I checked the Citizen pages crossreferencing to casings but that part only deals with casings as 54-xxxxx and none of mine 51-xxx type are mentioned. The potential alternatives I found were all under the XS series and I guess my best bet is to try from these. The generic snap-on type could have been an alternative if one could somehow derive the inner diameter but the edge thickness is nowhere to be found as far as I can see. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  11. Crystal replacement

    Hi jdm, I’m inclined to say you are correct about Citizen... It appeared to be the Sternkreutz SX series that would be in direction of my Citizen that is marked 51-204 on the case back. To begin with, it looked pretty bright as I found both 51-201 & 51-203. But then obviously nothing for 51-204 :-( Another complication is that my existing crystal has a quite significant inner height of 3,5 mm which (if really needed, which is hard for me to estimate) reduces the alternatives further. I took some notes on what could be in the neighborhood of the original. You find it attached. An even further complication is that my crystal has a magnifier for the date which in practise seem to reduce the alternatives to a very round figure ”0”. I guess I can do without that though. I find the problem a bit strange as I have seen several photos of this watch on the web with the same 51-204 print on the back and it’s hard to accept that I should be the only one in need of swapping out a bad crystal... Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  12. Crystal replacement

    Thanks rogart63, I will investigate these sites closely. If I get you right, this means I should look for replacements designed for these specific cases rather than looking among the more generic types from Sternkreuz and others? The one in the photo actually belongs to a Citizen Newmaster Jet Autodater with its rather special auto-winding design. I tried to Google for the various numbers I see on the back cover but nothing relevant has come up. I even posted a question on a website/forum specializing on Citizen watches but had zero response. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  13. Crystal replacement

    Hi all, I have a few watches waiting for replacement crystal where the design isn’t the usual snap-in for which I have used my claw-like tool for removal and insert. These are presumably much more precise as they fit snugly onto an edge in the case and are kept in place by a ring that is pressed on top. A photo is attached. My assumption is that these crystals must be defined by the inner diameter (and possibly the edge thickness) that goes onto the case. Going into ex. Cousins pages on crystals makes my head spin with the huge variety that seems to exist and I thought I might save myself from learning the hard way and ordering the wrong ones by asking you guys... The watches are ordinary Citizens and Seikos, so I guess it shouldn’t be that hard if you have been there, done that a few times...? /bsoderling Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  14. AS2063 inca variety

    Quick update... High power magnifier and a sewing needle soon made me realize that the ”hooks” on these springs are much longer than what I´m used to from the regular inca-springs. In my previous attemps I had actually never released the spring, just shifted it slightly. I attached a photo for anyone interested .... Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  15. AS2063 inca variety

    So no magic button hidden somewhere that will pop them open :-) Guess I will have to get my most super magnifier glass on and get real to close to see what’s going on.... Thanks for the kind spares offer if things go south, always appreciated. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk