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  1. Hi guys, I wrote this lesson for my second students to understand the theoretical aspects of the Swiss lever escapement in conjunction with the practical application of end-shake and setting jewels using a jewelling tool. Both Seitz and Horia-type jewelling tools were used. Although I talk about measurements using the settings on the side of the jewelling tools, it is more about what 'feels' right, especailly when gauging the end-shake of a particular component, such as the balance, pallet and escape wheel. Ideally, you wouldn't start by adjusting the end shake of the balance to suit your needs, but if the IncaBloc setting has been replaced or the Inca setting has been moved to replace the shockproof spring, then it is important to set the end-shake correctly. This presentation also looks at how to set the correct end-shake of the pallet in relation to the balance safety roller as well as other critical measurements, including the height of the escape wheel teeth hitting the impulse face of the pallet fork in both dial-up and dial down positions. The escape wheel and pallet have to have the exact same end-shake as each other for this reason. Unfortunately, the slides that contain videos can't be played as I converted the PowerPoint into PDF. I have used some diagrams from a WOSTEP handout on this subject, to show the vital measurement of the escapement in relation to the balance safety roller, so all credit goes to the author of that hand-out, which has been posted several times on this forum. All the students that set all the jewels after removing them and the balance end-shake to its optimum got a watch movement working with much improved amplitude than when they started. All ten jewels in the wheel train were removed as well as both IncaBloc settings. Another lesson was created just about the balance setting and disassembly and assembly of the EtaChron balance system which included removing a replacing that Inca setting. I haven't included that lesson. Not every aspect of this work is within the presentation, as it would be very long otherwise. I talk a lot and explain more as the lesson proceeds. This lesson was held over six to seven hours. If anyone is interested in learning more on this subject, please message me. Lesson 16. Balance endshake & Incabloc adjustment.pdf Lesson 16. Balance endshake & Incabloc adjustment.pdf
    14 points
  2. I have wanted a Robur watch crystal press and dies for a long time, but when considering the cost of about £510 (CousinsUK, excluding shipping and VAT) I just couldn't defend it. However, as the Robur-like press, shown in my video, now and then shows up in various YouTube videos I got curious and ordered it from AliExpress. I don't think it's on par with the Robur press, but for the price, it seems like a decent option. In the video, I happened to mention that I was going to link to my WRT service walkthroughs, so below is the list in case anyone would be looking for it. Hope you'll find my video useful! My Service Walkthroughs: Citizen 8200A ETA 2892-A2 2804-2 2836-2 955.112 2772 2472 2824-2 Vostok 2431 2409 Enicar 161 Miyota 8205 9015 Tissot 781 Omega 268 Orient 46E40 Unitas 6380 6325
    10 points
  3. Hello lovely watch people, i rarely post up my watches and i should do more of them because we all love to see and read stories about them. So today, i do have a little story of yesterday but first i ask to bend the rules and post not one but two watches side by side. The Sekonda in my picture i believe belonged to my dad's father, i found it while emptying my dad's flat after he died a few years ago. This is the watch that started it all for me, in terrible condition but after 2 failed attempts at restoration it now happily sits ticking away on my wrist most days. As for yesterday's story, i attended 100 miles away from where i live my 93 year old uncle's funeral my mum's brother, a kind and generous loving family man who will be sadly missed. Now his father my other grandfather worked for many years keeping the shipping lanes clear and safe for vessels coming into the Hull docks in the town where i live. After many years he retired and received the traditional retirement watch for good service often a Smiths watch was given. From my mum I became aware of his watch less than a year ago and obviously my interest was sparked so i began to ask questions of it's whereabouts and if possible could i have some photos of it so i could hunt down the same brand and model. Turns out my uncle had given it to his son 20 years ago and pictures promptly arrived on my phone from my cousin. It was indeed a Smiths Astral which by strange coincidence i had already collected 5 of but not that particular model. I began my hunt for the same one and by another strange coincidence i found the exact model for sale in the same 9ct gold case not 400 yards from my house, i was very happy. Back to the funeral, sat drinking with some of my family my mum takes my hand opens it and places my grandfather's watch in my palm " thats for you " she said. My cousin had given her the watch to do with it as she saw fit, six of my family including myself got hmm well rather emotional. As it happens my grandfather hardly wore it, my uncle never wore it and neither did my cousin who had kept it in a drawer for 20 years and could have quite easily given it to his son. I was told yesterday that " it's now in the right hands ". Coincidences are a strange thing, I'm a big believer in fate, my grandfather's brother was a watch and clock repairer and lived just 2 minutes from my house, my treasured new watch was given to my grandfather on his retirement the same year i was born. I kind of believe it's been making its way to me for the last 57 years. If you've stuck with me this long then i thank you and you need a bloody medal . Here is grandpa Jack on the left and grandpa Fred on the right. Soooooooooo happy today .
    10 points
  4. This video demonstrates how to hold a burnisher comfortably, safely, and efficiently for burnishing a wheel pivot in a Jacot tool—a huge thank you to @nickelsilver, who generously shared this information. I can’t thank you enough! https://www.watchrepairtalk.com/topic/28602-longines-balance-staff-pivots-are-they-too-flat/page/2/#comment-241887
    7 points
  5. I don‘t have to do this task (replace balance staff) often, maybe one time in a year. As I ruined a Valjoux 72 balance wheel by pushing the staff out without any work on the staff before, I became a fan of the „grind the hub away“ method. So here is a description of my amateur without lathe setup. I put the balance in a vice, hub side up. I use my micromot with a ball grinding attachment. Then I grind the staff away freehand until the rest of the hub is maybe 0.5 mm. Then I put the micromot in a stand and adjust the height roughly. Now I grind away the hub step by step by putting sheets of paper (0.05 mm thickness) under the vice. Stand and vice have to be placed on a very flat table of course. When the hub is grinded down to about 0.05 - 0.1 mm you can punch it out in the staking set (correct support from the downside!), the thin rest of the hub will just break off, no damage to the hole, as many others already mentioned. As always you should first try this with a balance from the scrap box.
    7 points
  6. Sooo, after initially following @HectorLooi's advice and kinda abandoning this project and then following @VWatchie's advice of waiting patiently for a good deal on a complete set, my moment has come: For an incredible 125 EUR, I managed to get a pristine (basically unused) "new style" Steiner set. It's the large set with the center wheel runner. In addition to two perfect lantern discs (hidden under the covers), a another perfect pair of spare runners were also included. The burnisher was not included, but after such a bargain on the tool, I treated myself to a new Bergeon burnisher. And a pair of retractable keyholders ;-). Now I need to practice.
    7 points
  7. New crystal fitted XAC 321.577 .Tension ring inner diameter of 27.5mm hides the gap nicely.
    6 points
  8. I have several of these pastel storage boxes. See? a degree in art does have value!
    6 points
  9. I saw a mention in one thread with the OP saying they could not take good photos of a watch movement they were asking about, so I thought I'd post my ultra-cheapo method: A local second hand shop had a stack of the nasty looking "clip on" lens kits for smartphones; they were priced at 50p so I got one out of curiosity. I didn't even try they for weeks, until I was struggling to take a high enough magnification of a damaged piece of jewellery, for a friend. The "macro" lens in these kits is actually amazing, it's very effective - and the full kits around only around £3 to £4 on ebay. The first photos are the particular 50p lens kit I got, and the lens I'm using from that, then examples photos, using my iphone with the macro lens in the clip and approximately centred over the camera lens. It does need a good light, and finding the exact height for best focus can be tricky sometimes, but the results are worth it. The movement is a Junghans calibre 73 from ebay:
    6 points
  10. Haven't posted for a while as I've had family visiting and then sick with a cold . but did manage to work on this Gruen (AS 5203) watch which has really grown on me. It also has a cool escapement setup, and an even stranger keyless works (no sliding pinion!). Picture of pallet fork (stock image): Here is the before shot: Movement with and without automatic works: Here is the dial side showing the complicated keyless works without a sliding pinion Here is a closeup on that pallet fork in the movement: showing only 1 banking pin The image below shows the mechanism where the hands setting wheel is not horizontally brought into position, instead it engages and disengages vertically, rather than use a sliding pinion (stock image): And here is the finished watch with its new strap and crystal (original was cracked):
    6 points
  11. Total amateur. Can do most things now. Just need to practice more. Tools? What tools?
    6 points
  12. Just finished this one, a 1970 Bulova Golden Clipper 'H' on the original bracelet.
    6 points
  13. You seem to have posted 8 pictures the same, each one tells no more than the previous except what trousers you are wearing . Ebel was one of the brands used by the British MOD during WW2 ( ATP ) this looks military ? so it should have something decent inside.But we wont know that unless we can see it, this brand doesn't come up too often so will be interesting to see. The movement will give a date range to it's age, value is usually estimated, its only worth what one/some want to pay for it. Crack it open .
    6 points
  14. yes one of the problems with the group is it can't stay on track and were going to discuss all the theoretical first which I'm going to do to because everyone else does it and then we'll get back to the problem of your watch. one of the things I like locally as we have the remnants of well at one time it was in AWCI chapter but we left them and still are functioning. One of the people who's given a lot of lectures was the head watchmaker of the service center for chain of jewelry stores it has stores all up and down the West Coast and a few other places. So he would comment share the knowledge from people like Rolex. So Jeff demonstrated a particular Rolex that we found or I found quite fascinating. The particular Rolex you could not remove the hairspring there was no way to get it all. He remove the roller table by using a lathe and holding onto the roller table and just rotating the balance of removing up that way it was the easiest way. Otherwise he may have used razor blades or something to get the table off don't quite remember because that's not what I was impressed with. So how to get the hairspring off the Rolex how to get the staff out easy it's designed very specifically designed exactly what I quoted above.using the Horia tool and all the special bits and pieces that came in a really nice wooden box and probably cost a small fortune. And asking everybody to be really quiet in the room he started pressing and then the rivet sheers off with a pleasant pop. Then he picked up the rivet part that popped off and walked around the room and showed us there is a beautiful ring were the rivet just sheared right off because it's designed to do that with the only way that you can remove the staff is that as the staff has to be pushed out of the hairspring collet it's designed to work this way. then here's a snippet from a AWCI magazine from 2014 and how exactly are they removing the staff here's something that Rolex has so punching out is the work of the devil but yet Rolex and AWCI says pushing out is there a difference or is there something else going on that were not paying attention to? I always find the term in school interesting? the reason for this is schools can vary depending upon the instructor if you start gathering up people to specific schools and asked specific questions he begin the wonder if you even went to the same school at all because of various instructors how people were taught etc. etc. so for instance my first school the instructor liked to weaken the rivet as he called it. Balance staff in the latest that he would just take a little whiff of metal off and then using either the two methods quoted above knock the staff. Then later on in the other school we had this really nifty tool that just ground the hub off in the staff fell out which worked perfect providing it was set correctly for the particular size watches we were all doing. Then this discussion has occurred somewhere else in the universe remember the person Jeff I mentioned he was annoyed with the discussion somewhere else in the universe and get a lecture for us. So in his particular lecture he totally watch that he had been at whole bunch of balance staffs for and I think he staff did at least 10 times and drove the staff out every single time with no problems at all done. So what does this demonstrate? Now to understand better we have to go back to a previous lecture yes Jeff is given lots and lots of lectures. In a previous lecture Jeff and Doug gave a staffing lecture on Jeff did modern watches and Doug did pocket watches. Too long ago to remember the exact details of everything but the general consensus was you can not the staff out as long as it's not in super tight. in other words with a rivet is over the arms or something else is going on and tapping is not going to take it out you're going to have to cut things or something else? One of the lectures I think the last one especially if it's the beryllium copper balance wheels or brass you just remove your hairspring roller table and then use alum and dissolve the staff out after all it's still in the rest of it's not it can be safely dissolved out. now we're back to the interesting problem of balance staff? Do we have one procedure for everything across the board with no variations of course not that assumption would be extremely stupid which is the problem with some of this discussion. The Hamilton watch company the Elgin watch company and Rolex have all designed specific staffs that will break. They've specifically say in their literature you can knock the staff out Elgin even goes so far as to bring up the balance wheels themselves. I'm attaching a PDF from the Hamilton watch company replacing a balance staff. it's an interesting handout explaining of that somebody skilled in replacing a balance staff shouldn't have an issue but those starting out or going to have issues which is why they have a handout. like everything else in watch repair requires practice and knowledge of what you're doing. on the first page there is some cautions let me snip out the image because we get something really interesting that I've highlighted? notice the reference to the balance arm simplistically it has to be harder than the staff itself which would either be steel in this particular case which brings up the problem of watches with brass or soft balance wheels. The unfortunate problem of variations another major problem to watch repair one method doesn't necessarily work everywhere now on the second page you are reading the second page are you not? Sometimes I think when I attach PDFs no one bothers to read them at all. They show weakening the rivet and gently tapping the staff put. Which means using any one of the tools for driving a staff out work just fine as the rivet should be weakened and it should come out. then notice on pages 3 and 4 explain in detail about their new staff designed specifically to do what and explain how to put it in how it looks etc. and basically we end up with this picture the staff is designed to be driven out safely without problems. while looking for the Elgin balance wheel issue here's something interesting if you're ever looked up watch patents I'm convinced that everything has been patented at least once every single aspect of everything which of course presents challenges for other companies at the time. Here's an interesting image the taxes interesting it basically says a multi-method assembly method with one aspect being used for disassembly or basically break the rivet when you knock your staff out here's an Elgin patent as the patent was granted obviously it has to be somehow different than the Hamilton yet achieves the same goal a way of disassembling your staff from the balance without destroying everything Elgin was even so happy with their staff they had a handout with a talk about its wonderful features and how to use it identify it etc. here's something important for Elgin their nifty new balance wheel which basically Hamilton has also pointed out if the balance wheel arms are harder than the staff itself you can drive the staff out. now hopefully everybody grasps that everything is possible all the methods can work and all the methods can fail. There is no perfect method as usual and watch repair their lots of different ways to achieve the final goals and lots of ways to destroy the balance and everything else in the watch. identical? let's repeat the steps of replacing a balance staff as we are now aware it's 100% identical it was made by the Elgin watch company with the correct dimensions and it's perfect and yet it doesn't work let's just review anyway? in the procedure especially on vintage always best to use a micrometer and measure the old staff and the replacement staff the dimensions have to exactly agree. It would also be nice if they agreed with whatever you perceive is supposed to go in this watch. Which is easy we only have one balance staff so says the pocket watch database how many mistakes could they have? so as you can see only one balance staff one balance staff number and there's a note? This by the way is my favorite balance staff because how many balance staffs are there? All with the same part number of all of variations and for this discussion we can explore all of that because the balanced seat is 1.30 mm to all the staffs should work they just won't be the right staff but they should still rivet just fine. in addition to the specifications above is the replace of balance staff actually made by Elgin or as an aftermarket and is the shape of the riveting shoulder the same as what the original had yes there can be other sizing variations then in this entire discussion this is the only picture I see like this and we really need a slightly different angle to see what we need to see because this despite its curvature looks almost concave a little bit at the critical part and if not it's flat with the curvature and is that what is specified for doing a balance staff? Yes I see images above and they don't quite correspond do they? then this is a interesting picture isn't it? I have to go and find another balance staff to look at but definitely you haven't push the rivet down at all and I don't know I just don't like the look of this. Hamilton technical data number 129 replacement of broken balance staffs.pdf
    6 points
  15. It's no difference using a platex tool or any other method to perform the same task. The risk comes from the rivet being forced through the hole in the balance arms and potentially opening up the hole and not the tool itself. You're correct that removing the rivet or hub when in a lathe isn't fool proof, just as any operation in watchmaking, but from personal experience it is a lot safer than just forcing a balance through the hole of the balance arms. When you perform this task using both methods, then you will more than likely favour cutting the hub off first, as this minimises the risk we are talking about. As I've already said, there are many ways to perform a task in watchmaking and I never want to dispute what works for someone. If it works, then carry on. I'm not trying to change anyone's mind to how someone should remove a balance. I've used both ways to do this and they both work, but it is safer to cut the hub or rivet first, as I have opened up the hole like the OP is experiencing now. The one thing I love about this forum is we can discuss different ways to do things and learn from each other. From knowledge comes experience, which then leads to wisdom You're most welcome. I'm glad I could help
    6 points
  16. In school we were shown the punching out method, using a K&D tool that presses down on the balance arms to keep things flat (as the Platax tool does), but were told the proper technique was cutting away the hub. They showed us the punch method simply because many professional watchmakers only ever do it that way. On a Glucydur balance, which is heat treated beryllium copper and very hard, there is less risk of enlarging the hole; likewise with steel balance arms. But not all bimetallic balances are heat treated, and many monometallic balances are made of nickel, and these will almost certainly see their holes enlarged from punching. I don't do much Rolex work, but I understand that on the modern pieces they instruct to press the staff out with a Horia tool. As I heard the staff is designed in a way that the rivet breaks away during this process. I wouldn't try it on anything else!
    6 points
  17. I think there maybe a perception issue around Marks video for @nevenbekriev , Mark targets videos towards us who are trying to learn about it all and would find the idea never mind the expense of one a lathe for best current practice to be out of reach. To this end I suspect that the staking set method of driving out the balance staff is actually a well accepted practice for professional watchmakers , although perhaps not the best. Having spent a lot of my life teaching people how to do my job and creating best practice on a per customer basis I maybe understand more how this misunderstanding could come about. I truly believe both nev and Mark have our best interests at heart and only want us to improve as we go and become the best watchfiddlers we can be. my tuppence Tom
    6 points
  18. Hello all, So for my birthday, I asked my wife for a stereo-microscope (actually, I told her exactly which one I wanted). I've read many times (and seen this video of Alex https://youtu.be/tAtATqwI5A4?si=NlU3TwHFBwpDKitw) that a good stereo microscope would be a "game changer". I resisted for the longest time, and ended up buying a staking set, jewelling set, glass press... heck, even a Jacot tool. But now I made the jump. And OH MY GOODNESS, it is so much more amazing and "game changing" than I ever imagined. I go the Amscope SM-3TP (https://amscope.com/products/c-sm-3tp-hd), with light ring and 0.5 Barlow lens. It delivers the perfect amount of magnification and working distance. (Please note that the 3TP version allows you to use full stereo vision while using the camera port at the same time. The 3T version used by Alex (see video link about) will force you to either use stereo-vision for your eyes and NOT use the camera port at all, OR use the camera port but only have mono-vision on your eyes. The camera port and the left eyepiece share the same "tunnel" and there's a lever that you pull/push to decide which one is active. I definitely recommend paying 20 bucks more to get the 3TP.) I think that one really needs to experience a stereo microscope like this to fully appreciate how incredible it is. Pictures (which are two-dimensional) will never do it justice. To see three-dimensionally is SOOOOO useful. I've never oiled a pallet stone with such perfect accuracy and ease. And I can see in perfect clarity how the drop of oil spreads over the next 3-5 escape wheel teeth. Until I apply another perfect drop in the perfect spot. And INSPECTION: my goodness. You'll find the tiniest speck of dust or debris with ease. Honestly, I'm over the moon with this new acquisition. After using it for 3 days, I can't even imaging how I lived without it.
    6 points
  19. News Update 29/02/2024 Yesterday Cousins and its legal team went to the High Courtin London to oppose the application by Swatch to have our UK claim struck out. The case was heard by Mr. Justice Michael Green, a High Court Judge who also sits in the Competition Appeal Tribunal. In previous news stories, I have explained the arguments that we intended to bring, and I will not repeat them here. However, I am in no doubt that by the end of the day, Judge Green had a full picture of the consequences for Competition if Cousins action is not allowed to proceed. It was noteworthy that the Competition and Markets Authority sent a member of their Legal Team to observe proceedings from the Public Gallery. As expected, after more than five hours of evidence and legal argument, Judge Green advised that he would consider the matter further and release a written verdict in due course. Afterwards, our legal team said that the case had gone as well as it could have done, and better than they had thought likely. There is no fixed timetable for the verdict, it entirely depends upon the workload Judge Green has, but we hope to be able to advise you of the outcome in a matter of weeks rather than months. Regards Anthony
    6 points
  20. @rossjackson01I would start with a perfectly working movement, that has the correct endshake of the gear train and balance, with a high amplitude and a perfectly new mainspring, so you are eliminating as many variables as possible to start with. You can then rule out any initial problems with the movement. Screwing down bridges and cocks tightly should/will have no bearing on amplitude. In fact not tightening them properly will give you problems! I would then move on to using proper cleaning fluid and rinse, rather than lighter fluid and IPA. They work fine, but it would eliminate that variable as well. Watchmaking is witling down what it can't be and you're left with the possibilities, then probabilities. Always do only one thing and measure the result of that change or adjustment. A good movement would be an ST36 from AliExpress, which I use for my teaching. Cheap as chips. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005872942857.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.order_list_main.23.55171802P4233F Measuring the endshake of a balance is vital. The more you do it the more you'll know what feels and what feels wrong. A lot of movements would be about 0.02 to 0.04 mm endshake of the balance, but the St36 is close to 0.08 to 0.09 mm, as it is a very big movement. I take a class on reducing and increasing endshake of the balance and seeing the huge drop in amplitude by adjusting the balance endshake by as little as 0.03 mm tighter or looser on the ST36. Usually the big drop will be in vertical positions, but also in horizontal ones as well, but not as much. At least using a new movement will eliminate that variable of too much or little balance endshake to start with, although I had an Incabloc setting move with a students watch this week and I had to increase the setting by 0.06 mm so the balance didn't stop when the balance cock was tightened. Checking the impulse face of the pallet stones is also vital, as they have to be mirror clean. I use Moebius 9415, but at a push you can get away with 9010. You'll get there, I'm sure!
    6 points
  21. Over the last weeks I followed VWatchies thread about his ETA 2763 showing erratic amplitude: https://www.watchrepairtalk.com/topic/28929-serviced-eta-2763-having-erratic-rate-and-amplitude/page/4/#comment-245378 I have a similar problem on an Omega 861. The base movement shows alternating amplitude in both horizontal and vertical positions. The range is more than 25 degrees, no periodical behavior, pure random. In the above quoted thread there was a lot of talk about the regulator pins, hairspring, collet, geartrain, etc. and I do not doubt that all these may be sources for the problem. However, I couldn‘t get one question out of my head: Can the problem be on the other side - mainspring, barrel, ratchet wheel? Some kind of error which prevents the barrel from delivering constant torque to the center wheel? To find out where to look I built the following setup: I assembled the movement without barrel and ratchet wheel. Then after some research and calculation about torque in the geartrain I 3D-printed this part and completed it with an axle and a pin. The movement in a well chosen vertical position. Please notice the spoke of the center wheel. Now the „torque generator“ is fitted to the center wheel. The axle is pushed into the pinion and the pin is lying on the spoke. Finally I have to choose the correct weight to get a torque which results in an amplitude in the area of 280 degrees ( yes, watchmaking is an expensive hobby - my 2 cents). And that‘s all. When the lever is in nearly horizontal position this setup provides a nearly constant torque on the center wheel for several minutes (I assume you live in an area with constant gravity). For me this one answered my question. The alternating amplitude was gone, less than 4 degrees fluctuation now, which is always the case with my Weishi. So the source of my problem is somewhere in the area of the barrel - will work on that the following days.
    5 points
  22. My first attempt at silvering of watch hands. First I rubbed the hands back to the brass with 7000 grit paper. Then I polished a bit with pegwood and 1 micron diamond paste. Cleaned in solvent (Essence of Renata is what I have handy). Then used silvering powder as directed from Priory polishes (eBay). Finished of with a brush stroke of lacquer to avoid tarnishing. I think they look quite good, a nice satin effect.
    5 points
  23. Ricoh has a similar pallet fork Tressa 1970s ETA 2788 Unusual Grey Sunburst Dial all original except for the crystal Running really well for its age, + 0.5 SPD, 300 degrees amplitude horizontal after 12 hours. I have another crystal arriving next week with a wider tension ring that I hope can hide the gap between the dial and case (XAC 321.577). Wide tension ring crystals appear to be few and far between so if anyone has any tips for a good source then that's most appreciated. I did look at ATCB range from Sternkreuz but they seem a bit higher than I would like based on the dimensions.
    5 points
  24. After a long delay, I finally got a larger o-ring to seal the crystal. Somehow it's not thick enough to really grab the crystal, despite being the same size as the old one. Either way, the design of the case very firmly seals the crystal against the inside of the case, so I'm just going to wear it and keep it out of the sink. I think Pop-pop would be proud. And just to round out the whole story, mom texted me this after I sent pictures:
    5 points
  25. There is a tool for this, if you can find one. It's called an Obama Jewel Hole Gauge. It consists of a finely tapered pin which you push into the hole as far as it will go. The pin then pushes back into the body of the instrument until the jewel is against the tip. The hole diameter can then be read off the scale in 0.01mm increments down to 0.05mm. If you could find a suitably fine tapered pin there's no reason why you couldn't improvise by marking where the jewel sits on the taper and then measuring it with a micrometer. In practice though if you are replacing a jewel you could always just measure the pivot that is going to run in it.
    5 points
  26. A basic check one does when checking a hairspring is how well centered and flat it is at the collet. Out of flat is visually quite clear in the watch, out of center is harder to describe, mainly the inner 1/2 of the coils look "jumpy" as the balance oscillates. Adjustment is done with the balance out, hairspring on, in ideally a set of hairspring truing calipers. These permit a better view of the spring, and better access, than regular calipers, though those work as well. Adjustment is done on the first 180 degrees or so of the spring from the collet. The caliper is adjusted so the balance can spin with no play. Just slowly turning the balance, follow the first coil/s of the spring from its exit from the collet, and it should make a nice progressive spiral. If it is out of center, it will seem to spiral out, then cease, then out, or even go back-and-forth sort of. As with everything it takes a bit of practice to figure out where and how much to adjust, but the basic rules of hairspring adjusting still apply. Adjustment in the flat is done 180 degrees from maximum error, in the round, 90 degrees. When checking the flat in the caliper, you have to focus on the first 4-5 coils, as the rest are influenced by the weight of the stud and will naturally look low. When all good, those first few coils will look distinctly flat viewed from the side, and the whole spring will look like one of the optical illusion spirals as the balance slowly spins (viewed from above). The effect on timing from a spring out of true at the collet can vary from almost unnoticeable to rather extreme. I was just working on a new-build, first time on the timing machine. I saw there was a little truing needed at the collet, but ran a cycle anyway. In my case, the verticals were slow compared to the horizontal, with an apparent poise error equaling 60s. I trued it at the collet, and the difference in both h/v and the "poise error" were cut in half. Another reason not to chase dynamic poise if everything isn't as perfect as possible. The effect of centering at the collet is used by good regleurs sometimes by introducing an error. Sometimes you find the verticals just want to run slow, with regulator pins adjusted perfectly etc. Like, perfect poise, but 15s slower than horizontal. Sometimes throwing the centering out at the collet by say half a spring thickness can resolve this. It is pretty much unnoticeable visually. Also, you have to guess which way to "throw it out", haha. A Levin hairspring truing caliper and a Swiss simple caliper that works well too
    5 points
  27. the ramifications of putting the roller jewel in the wrong location is the watch will not be in beat and it will never run. one of things you should always check on a watch especially after replacing the balance staff is to verify that the watch visually is in beat. The above quote is telling you that and I'm attaching a picture so you can visually see what it should look like.
    5 points
  28. Pull the roller table and put it back where it should be. The position of the hairspring is (very) important too, there is often a little "pip" on the balance rim marking where the stud should line up. When in the watch, no power, the roller jewel should be in the fork slot, and the fork should be midway between the bankings.
    5 points
  29. @Qutadah, see, You first need to have the watch in You hands, or at least to have good pictures of the movement. What the seller says is useless, as if He understands enough of watchmaking, He would repair the watch. We need to see this hairspring, as it may be really bad, but it may be quite easily repairable too. And it concerns not only the hairspring, but all the other parts... The main problem that I see is that You intend to repair this small and fragile calibre without having any experience. Such attempts usually end up with ruined hairspring and/or broken pivots. Actually, the hairsprings end up ruined never by themselves, but only because someone did'nt handle them properly.
    5 points
  30. Time to test my skills 3 watches, all working. In need of servicing. From purchase to end. Lets see how I go. Herlin. Grand Prix. Roma (facet crystal)
    5 points
  31. You'll always be holding the stake so it doesn't follow through to even get close the the balance arms and be tapping it lightly enough so you don't lose control over that stake, but I do understand that it could happen that the stake hits the balance arm. That would be down to the technique you use when using the stake and a watchmakers hammer. Always have control of the stake and accidents are less likely to happen. I'm going to do a video (not like there aren't many showing this) to show how to perform both methods of removing a balance staff by cutting the hub and using a staking tool. My website/SEO guy is always on at me to add more content to my YouTube channel, so this will get him off my back for a while and maybe give me impetus to post more techniques
    5 points
  32. I don't take it like that, so no worries. I understand that both Cousins and Gleave advertise the same GR mainspring as 2377X, but the point I'm making is sometimes what mainspring advertised isn't what is sold. That's why I said about the mainspring for the ETA 2824-2. So, Cousins have that spring as a GR57162 which is 1.23 x .134 x 400 x 10.5. Gleave and Co. have the spring for an ETA 2824-2 as a GR3149X which is advertised as 1.23 x .134 x 400 x 10.8 and a GR3149X on Cousins website is down as 1.25 x .125 x 420 x 10.5 Now look at the GR mainspring size table I've attached and it says a GR57162 is 1.25 x .125 x 420 x 12 and the GR 3149X is 1.25 x .125 x 420 x 12 There is a lot of conflicting information right there! So, when I bought a mainspring from Gleave and Co. for the 7S26C, I actually bought an original Seiko 7009 spring from them and not a GR spring that they advertise, now I don't know what Gleave and Co. will actually send you here and now today, but last year it wasn't what they advertise now as the spring needed. You can email or phone them and ask for an original Seiko spring if they still have them. I've bought springs from Cousins in the past and when measured they are not the size that was advertised, so I'm assuming that people assume what they have been sold is what was advertised and what they require, which isn't always the case. 99.5% of the time I buy my mainsprings from Gleave and Co. and so do many watchmakers here in London, because if there is a problem with the wrong size being advertised or being received they will sort it out, where as Cousins more than likely won't, because they believe that they sent you the correct spring from the start and once the spring is out of its retaining ring, all bets are off, so to speak. Those same watchmakers, who I personally know, have been through all this with Cousins, so don't really bother with that kind of crap shoot anymore and rely on Gleave and Co. not to make those kind of mistakes. I think what I have said is a pretty important issue that many aren't aware about, especially when the springs inner coil won't fit the arbor and several springs are trashed in the process. I always tell my students, 'Never make assumptions!' Unless someone is measuring the dimensions of the mainspring, then don't assume it is the correct size just because someone says it is and relying on a sticker with a GR number on it that has been put on the packet by the seller. Me too!
    5 points
  33. That's valuable information for those on the lookout for their first Seitz jewelling tool! I guess I got lucky then! It didn't know about this when I bought mine. But even if you get the newer version, you need to make sure the respective adapter/knob is included. See pictures below.
    5 points
  34. I am sorry. My pen is sometimes more sharp than neded, and this is due my temper. The idea that someone might think the plates may be made not of brass, but of still, made me wonder how and why is this possible. But Rich is right, i don't see any difference in the meaning of the both phrases. See, the main problem of no jewels Timex watches is the wear of the balance staff tips. They wear for 2-3-4 years of constant use and the watch may still work, but with lo amplitude and bad timekeepinng. The way to restore the movement is to sharpen the tips and if they have been sharpened allready 2-3-times, then the cup bearings must be restored too. Just forget the other bearings, no significant inprovement will happen from there.
    5 points
  35. Well, after a service, finding some bit of metal in the gear of the step rotor and reassembly, no joy. Today I broke out the microscope and what did I find but a broken wire! That will do it every time. I was able to unwind the broken wire a turn and glue it down with some conductive ink. Voila! Back to running properly. Thanks so much for all of the helpful documentation and advice. It really fueled the fire of my though processes to get this fixed! I might have to wrist test it for a couple of weeks before giving it back to my brother though!
    5 points
  36. If watches could talk ... I gave my grandfather's pocket watch (Waltham) to my son on his 21st birthday. He wore it with his wedding suit and carried it with him to the hospital the day his son was born. I never thought it would mean that much to him. My other grandfather was a machinist so I got his tools.
    5 points
  37. I think the Lutheran prayer says it best. "God, grant me the serenity to accept the watches I cannot buy, the courage to buy the watches I can, and the wisdom to know the difference."
    5 points
  38. Some people think ANYTHING related to watches must be worth a fortune ‐----- Granted, there are 2350 fancy crystals, but 2349 will never be used
    4 points
  39. Well, I've done it. completed my first service on a pin movement. It was a non runner when I purchased it. When doing the service I found the reason. Two items on the crown wheel stopping rotation. Removed and cleaned. Only a cheap watch, but I wanted to try my skill. Pin are more difficult than jewelled watches, in my opinion. Running well. Disassembly 1 hr. Cleaning 1/2 hr. Assembly 1 1/2 hrs. Followed members instructions. Photograph each removal and watch in reverse for assembly. Happy bunny. thank you to all. Ross
    4 points
  40. OK, there are different reasons for differences in rate in horizontal versus vertical position. But the main reason which is the base of the all this reasons is decrease in amplitude in vertical versus hiruzontal positions. One of the basic reasons has it's roots in the formula for the real balance-hairspring system own resonant frequency, which is long and complicated formula that shows that free oscillations actually are not isochronic. Here is a page copy from old book for watch regulation theory, which shows different cases of ange beginning/end of the hairspring and the way this angle affects the rate. Well, this is in Russian, but the vertical axis is 'gain/delay' in seconds per day and horizontal axis is the amplitude in degr. So, what is imortant here is that if the hairspring shape is chosen correctly, it will be able to compensate the escapement effect on the rate when low amplitude and thus relatively isochronical work will be acieved. And if the hairspring is simply 'vibrated', with no idea of what angle beginning/end will receive in the end, then easily a difference of entire minute per day in vertical/horizontal positions can be achieved. But, this is the designer's duty. If it is regular balance-hairspring couple from the manufacturer, then such problem would not exist. The most probable reason in You case would be that the hairspring touches something and thus gets shorter when big amplitude. This 'something' well can be the collet, if the hairsprinfg is not centered there. To see if it is the case, we will need picture of the hairspring where the collet is seen. So, remove balance from the cock, put it hairspring up and make a photo of the hairspeing
    4 points
  41. Another fan of Smiths watches here. Nice to have an English made watch. I'm currently working on a 19J cal 0104. I fitted a new crown. Just a generic one from Cousins Parts are usually quite easy to find should you have a mishap. I was making a final tweak to the hairspring on mine yesterday, when it snapped at the stud I looked in my drawer of Smiths parts. There was only one part in the drawer - a complete balance for an 0104 ! Couldn't believe my luck.
    4 points
  42. There's a section in "The Chicago School of Watchmaking" on centring the collett. chicago lesson 19.PDF
    4 points
  43. whenever I have timing problems at work usually the first thing I look at is the plot like this and the oscilloscope. I use it to explain why I'm having timing problems. But based on my past knowledge of you and a timing machine I would throw all of this away because you're going to lose your mind and become obsessed about a problem that you may or may not ever be able to fix or a problem doesn't actually exist sort of. yes one of the problems with the watch is a set of gears that in order to produce absolutely linear perfect power ideally shouldn't even be gears at all as gears will always produce pulsations of power. Then if everything isn't exactly perfect like the manufacturing the wheels are slightly out around pivots that don't fit absolutely perfectly or even if somebody furnishes the pivots and are slightly too small soup of flopping around in the whole not by very much conceivably will cause power surges as the tiny bit of the wheels moving around binding up with the gear train. Watches are really interesting things in that the average out a lot of their problems. Timing machines though will show all of these problems that may or may not really be a problem. For instance with this watch does it actually keep time with the hands on? I have a interesting book recommendation is that expensive book I have a video of a book review. It has a nice job of reviewing it it's not a perfect book but it sometimes has its moments. Like for instance there's a section on gears. then it even is a section on the faults of gearing fortunately that's only a couple of pages I could probably scanned that in. Where I'm going with this is watches are mechanical devices gear trains produce power fluctuations watches will still keep really good time with power fluctuations up to a certain points. Be careful not to get obsessed about timing machines software or if you think your first experience with a timing machine was a nightmare this will send you straight to the psychiatric ward. Understand why you're using the software and why you're looking at it. it's amazing how a few words can instantaneously cause of flashback to something in the past which I found to be a pain in the ass. One of my friends had centered his hairspring exactly as you describe and had it perfectly centered exactly as you described. But physically centering without the balance wheel in this case with the Hamilton 992 result of the hairspring that was not flat and not right at all with the over coil. I spent hours of time analyzing trying to figure out where he bent looking at another watch to put the hairspring back right because of what I perceive a stupid method of doing things. The preferred centering is with the balance wheel and hairspring together. Exactly what is described in the first quote above. it's one of the objections I have when people have hairspring issues and everyone says take the balance out of the watch hairspring issues with balance wheels typically occur in the watch you have to be able to see the problem in the watch you don't always have to fix it in the watch but you have to see the problem in the watch balance wheels out of the watch a lot of times a look really nice but not in the watch and collets perfectly centered aren't actually centered at all necessarily.
    4 points
  44. one of the problems with multipage discussions is that it makes it hard to go back and reread everything so let's review the process? Did you measure the old staff and the new staff to verify that they're the exact same size? Then riveting despite the fact all the images show one round punch I usually use several of them. In other words I will start with the smallest one I can get start two spread the rivet then I'll do another one slightly larger to keep spreading the rivet or basically whatever it takes. Followed up with a flat punch to just flatten the whole thing out hopefully. The last watch I did didn't flatten out as well as I liked but is held nice and tight so worked fine. actually ended up with a small pile of staking set punches on the bench when doing it despite the fact the photos only show one magical punch I seldom find that works the way it shows in the picture. interesting method not sure I've ever seen it in any book and you really don't one of even begin to grasp what anyone understanding watch repair would think about this method. So if you solder a balance staff PN in a future watchmaker has to replace it is that going to be an issue? if you have a lathe visually the look really nice to impress your friends but they do have purposes in watch repair. Then why don't you start practicing with it and some scrap balance wheels I know hobbyist never practice it takes away the fun but still find some scrap balance wheels look on eBay practice cutting the hubs off see if you like that method. Personally I never did but to each his own. then find some metal start turning it on the lathe maybe make a balance staff a really big balance staff. Watch repair is all about practicing.
    4 points
  45. Wheels are generally rivetted to the pinions, and disassembly would ruin them. Some are friction fit, but again, disassembly would likely lead to a weaker union after reassembly. Best to clean them assembled.
    4 points
  46. The bladder for another fountain pen arrived today. So here is the follow up. How now *not* to replace the bladder in your precious fountain pen. The process started innocently enough. I attempted to unscrew the cap. Instead, the stainless sheath parted company from the plastic of the top and started to rotate. This produced two new problems. First, I obviously now needed to re-secure the stainless sheath to the cap, but more importantly, I couldn't actually unscrew the top from the pen. I reached for some light oil and attempted to dribble it in to the threads. In the process, I managed to pour it down my leg. Nice. "Well.." I reasoned, ".. these jeans needed to go in the wash anyway." so I pressed on undaunted. Next I wrapped some masking tape around the body and the top, and carefully grasped them with mole grips, trying in the process to avoid crushing anything. This worked better than expected and the cap started to unscrew. Unfortunately however, the next problem became obvious pretty quickly. The pen still had ink in it, which it proceeded to vomit on to my leg... "Well.." I reasoned, ".. these jeans needed to go in the wash anyway." so I pressed on undaunted. I cleaned up as much of the mess from my hands and leg and the pen as I could, and set about replacing the bladder. With the pen now spotless, and no obvious possible source of further trouble in view, I set about securing the stainless cap to the body. The cap by now was considerably more stainless than I was. I poured out a small measure of shellac into a little plastic container, and started to dribble it into the gap between the two components, and ... promptly poured the contents of the container onto my leg... "Well.." I reasoned, ".. I am clearly an idiot." so I pressed on undaunted. The job is more or less complete, but I suspect the jeans may never quite be the same again. Now I need to sneak them into the washing machine before my wife sees them, and hope that a quick boil wash will hide the majority of the evidence.
    4 points
  47. No mater what you use wear a mask in a well ventilated space and protective gloves.
    4 points
  48. The polishing worked out well. It only needed a bit of satin brushing on the sides and mirror polishing of the case back. The reason I got this watch (in dire need of a service) was because @nickelsilver spoke well of Peseux. Now this movement (Peseux 7040) probably wasn't their top-of-the-line but still performs very well after a service. No repairs (except replacing the scratched-up case and case back crystals) or adjustments were required so easy to work on. Here are the numbers. Fully wound minus 1 hour: Dial up: Rate: +5 s/d, Amp.: 310°, B.E.: 0.1ms Dial down: Rate: +3 s/d, Amp.: 305°, B.E.: 0.1ms Crown left: Rate: -1 s/d, Amp.: 260°, B.E.: 0.1ms Crown down: Rate: +8 s/d, Amp.: 265°, B.E.: 0.1ms Crown right: Rate: -5 s/d, Amp.: 275°, B.E.: 0.0ms Crown up: Rate: -12 s/d, Amp.: 265°, B.E.: 0.1ms Fully wound minus 26 hours: Dial up: Rate: +4 s/d, Amp.: 265°, B.E.: 0.0ms Dial down: Rate: 0 s/d, Amp.: 270°, B.E.: 0.0ms Crown left: Rate: -6 s/d, Amp.: 240°, B.E.: 0.1ms Crown down: Rate: +2 s/d, Amp.: 225°, B.E.: 0.2ms Crown right: Rate: -3 s/d, Amp.: 223°, B.E.: 0.0ms Crown up: Rate: -12 s/d, Amp.: 223°, B.E.: 0.1ms
    4 points
  49. I really don't think anyone is. I sometimes am interested in items where the seller believes they're sitting on a fortune whereas I know they are not. Letting them know the truth hopefully leads to a deal, but as Richard experienced more often than you might think it just annoys the seller. I even had an experience where the seller became very rude and threatened to block me for just very politely suggesting and explaining (linking to historical selling prices) that his asking price was way too optimistic.
    4 points
  50. Why policing eBay? Isn't it the free-market who determines the prices? And if it gets sold for a ridicules price, who's is the stupid one, the seller or the buyer?
    4 points
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